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Thread: Fiscal Responsibility is Dead

  1. #21
    tWebber carpedm9587's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    I would think that would be a "step two" -- "now that we have this MASSIVE debt, which, of course, was absolutely necessary, we must assure that everybody 'pay their fair share' and...."
    I'm tired of a "step two" that never materializes. Everyone is happy when the spending happens - and then they turn as yellow as Homer's backside when the time comes to adjust the income to pay the bills.

    The source of the funding should be stipulated in any spending bill - and a balanced budget should be a requirement at all times except a time of crisis and a time of war. Even then - the spending should have an attached plan for payment.
    The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

    I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

  2. #22
    tWebber carpedm9587's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    This is the model with which I am very much involved every day of my life - one KEY ingredient is accountability and trust. (ok, that's two. But, really, one.)

    If people see that money is being managed well - there are no extravagant "CEO" salaries or huge corporate offices - they're far more likely to contribute, especially if it's helping "the guy next door" as opposed to some guy across the country. (Yeah, I know, that shouldn't matter, but facts is facts)
    Indeed. Our group is 100% volunteer. 100% of everything donated goes out to the people who need it. The books are wide open for the entire community to see at any time. And we carefully choose the "face" of the group (the one who deals with the people in need). The first person chosen was chosen because of their popularity - but it quickly became clear that their tendency to gossip was a serious problem.
    The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

    I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

  3. #23
    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carpedm9587 View Post
    This bill, from the Democrats, is a travesty. $3T more borrowed from our grandchildren and their children to make things more comfortable for us in a time of struggle. I hope there are enough politicians to stand against this kind of waste and for a return to fiscal responsibility - but I suspect there are not. In a time of crisis, in a culture of entitlement, this has about as much chance of failing completely as the so-called "Patriot Act" did at a time when we were attacked.

    There are times when I wonder when/if common sense will ever return to this country.
    wow, we agree on something!

    Yeah, they seem to think they can just keep printing money and we won't have to face the consequences. And it won't even be our grandchildren who face the consequences, it will be us. Inflation will go through the roof, businesses will shut down permanently if we stay shut down, people will be unemployed permanently. We will enter a new Great Depression.

    Insane!

  4. #24
    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starlight View Post
    Why are you assuming Dems want to borrow that money, as opposed to funding this proposal through raised taxes?

    In general, Dems do typically want to raise taxes to pay for things they want to spend. Accusations against them of fiscal irresponsibility seem unjustified.
    how can you raise taxes when the economy is shut down? Businesses can't pay taxes if they are closed and people can't pay them if they are unemployed.

  5. Amen RumTumTugger amen'd this post.
  6. #25
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carpedm9587 View Post
    I'm tired of a "step two" that never materializes.
    EGGzackly -- it's always "you do this, then we'll do that" and "that" never happens.

    Everyone is happy when the spending happens -
    Not ME! Because I know it's most likely paying WAY too much, and lining the wrong pockets.

    and then they turn as yellow as Homer's backside when the time comes to adjust the income to pay the bills.
    I don't mind being taxed for money that is necessary with accountability.

    The source of the funding should be stipulated in any spending bill - and a balanced budget should be a requirement at all times except a time of crisis and a time of war. Even then - the spending should have an attached plan for payment.
    Nobody even PRETENDS to talk about that anymore!
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  7. #26
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carpedm9587 View Post
    Indeed. Our group is 100% volunteer. 100% of everything donated goes out to the people who need it.
    We have several paid staff just for the continuity and expertise (not necessarily in that order) but mostly a big army of volunteers, coordinating with other volunteer groups, both civic and faith-based.

    The books are wide open for the entire community to see at any time. And we carefully choose the "face" of the group (the one who deals with the people in need). The first person chosen was chosen because of their popularity - but it quickly became clear that their tendency to gossip was a serious problem.
    When I talk about "helping people" in Church, I always point out that there are those out there who live to scam, and no matter how careful you are, you WILL get scammed. HOWEVER, I'd rather accidentally help somebody who doesn't need it than NOT help somebody who was legitimately in need.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  8. Amen RumTumTugger amen'd this post.
  9. #27
    tWebber Mountain Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    If people see that money is being managed well - there are no extravagant "CEO" salaries or huge corporate offices - they're far more likely to contribute...
    I heard a talk by a guy who argued that it's a hindrance to non-profits to not be able to pay their CEO's a competitive salary. Some non-profits are as big as a major for-profit company, yet they're expected to pay CEOs a cut-rate salary which often results in them not being able to hire the best person for the job.
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

  10. #28
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Man View Post
    I heard a talk by a guy who argued that it's a hindrance to non-profits to not be able to pay their CEO's a competitive salary. Some non-profits are as big as a major for-profit company, yet they're expected to pay CEOs a cut-rate salary which often results in them not being able to hire the best person for the job.
    Yeah, we have three main "paid staff", and their salaries are competitive, but not exorbitant - occasionally we'll have somebody complain about how much we pay them, and we'll ask "would YOU do that job for that salary?" That pretty much shuts them down.

    On a national level, of course, they try to go with somebody with big name recognition for the fund raising aspect.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  11. #29
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    ...but mostly a big army of volunteers...
    We actually DO pay people like cooks, because we run a restaurant which is part of the income stream, but it's part of the job training part - we hire people, train them to cook or whatever, then allow them to be hired out by other community businesses. It's worked really well.

    People who eat at the restaurant know that they're contributing to the cause, and are generally very generous tippers, as well.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  12. #30
    tWebber Mountain Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    And it won't even be our grandchildren who face the consequences, it will be us. Inflation will go through the roof, businesses will shut down permanently if we stay shut down, people will be unemployed permanently. We will enter a new Great Depression.
    I suspect that's the goal. As far as the Democrats are concerned, no price is too high for us (not them) to pay if they think it will hurt Trump's chances in the next election.
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

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