Ahmaud Arbery; racist killing and attempted cover up.

[rogue06]

Find in this story another in the list: Jogging while black.

This doesn't look like jogging

uu.jpg

[oxmixmudd]

This doesn't look like jogging

[ATTACH=CONFIG]44927[/ATTACH]

Yeah - he stopped for a break. Again, what we see in this thread is the underlying culturally induced racism that is the problem in the first place. There are several other videos of other people visiting that same construction site. Yet they were not pursued, they have not been accused of trespassing. As you can see, the place is not locked, the exterior walls are in place, but there is not even yet insulation there. No one else is on the property, and the owner has made it know nothing was taken, nothing was vandalized.

So as You and MM continue to try to 'prove' something is amiss with Arbery, we see the continuing promotion of the racist narrative that surrounds this story and tries to provide proper motive for the shooter. But the reality is there is no evidence Arbery was doing anything but jogging and stopping for a break.

[shunyadragon]

This doesn't look like jogging

[ATTACH=CONFIG]44927[/ATTACH]

By the testimony of the landowner and other pictures his property was a common place for people to make a water stop in the neighborhood. Nothing was ever stolen by anyone who passed by.

[JimL]

This doesn't look like jogging

[ATTACH=CONFIG]44927[/ATTACH]

What's it look like to you, rogue? It's insinuations like that that make you, MM, et al, look like a racist.

[Ronson]

I'm going to enter this not as a reply, so as not to single out a person or persons here. But the question was raised, why the Arbery case, why not this other case where something bad happened where a young black man abused eldery white people. And so I want to deal with that as a general example of that needs addressing, not as a response to that specific instance.

There are two elements of this I want to address. One is the underlying paranoia that says this other case was ignored because it did not fit a left wing 'agenda'. I can not emphasize enough how destructive this underlying paranoia is to our nation right now. We are a nation divided, and nations(?) external to our own with an interest in dividing us are feeding that paranoia and many others like it. Is this my own 'conspiracy paranoia'?

No, not at all - It was recently reported that 45 to 60% of the underlying misinformation we see related to covid-19 is being pushed out onto the internet by internet 'bots'. Programs or automatic programs that push certain kinds of information - in this case MIS-information. Specifically inciting self-destructive behaviours. mis-Information about the characteristics of the virus. About wearing masks. About insidious goverment or media 'agendas' related to the existence of the virus and the pandemic.

https://www.npr.org/sections/coronav...re-likely-bots

https://www.technologyreview.com/202...eopen-america/

https://www.rollingstone.com/culture...-bots-1004328/

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/bots-ac...searchers-say/

I would therefore encourage as many of you as possible to take a step back and realize that if you are on the various "it's a conspiracy" bandwagons - including those that might surround this even - realize that in all likelyhood you are being manipulated with misinformation. Take a step back and consult alternate sources, dig into what has caught your fancy and that is feeding whatever paranoia you might have that is vulnerable to what is called 'confirmation bias', that tendency to believe things that confirm what we already believe.

The second element is more directly related to THIS thread: The paranoia that says this story is agenda based and blown out of proportion. First, this case is about a murder. But local murders rarely make national news. There has to be something more to elevate a case to national attention. One is just random chance - some element of the story that pushes it into the national spotlight. In this case that was the emergence of the shooting video itself on may 5. But even more than that, once the story could be seen, there were two other things that had to happen. The first is the underlying injustice associated with how the Georgia law enforcement in this community tried to suppress the event itself, how they did not move, possibly because one of their own was involved, possibly because race was invovled. Either way - the racial element, the mishandling by the prosecutors, pushed this to the attention of the black community itself during a time when - much like #metoo - there has been a series of events that has pushed focus onto the injustice that so many black people experience in terms of unequal treatment under the law and in interactions with law enforcement.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/24/us/ge...ive/index.html

Phrases that have grown in attention and which have become rallying cries in black communities:

Source: above

Driving while black, BBQing while black, Napping while black, Shopping while black, Waiting while black

© Copyright Original Source

Find in this story another in the list: Jogging while black.

So what we are dealing with is a cultural phenomenon where in black communities the injustice they experience every day took notice of this story as just another in a long line of injustices to black people doing ordinary activities. Jogging while black brings this story to the national attention, and the responses to it. Runners all across the country took a jog of the same approximate distance as Arbery's in solidarity with him. There is a general outcry against this sort of thing across the country, white and black.

As to that underlying racism that has created this entire movement, that has lifted phrases like "Driving while black" and "Jogging while black" to the forefront of the news we need look no further than this thread where attempts have been made in post after post to cast upon this black man the same sorts of racially motivated stereotypes that have given rise to the entire list and the focus itself. Attempts were made to say this man wasn't really 'jogging' when his entire life was marked by athletic prowess as a runner. He was, in fact, a runner, one who nearly every day went out for long jogs and runs. Indeed, as a high school athlete he was so fast his coaches had to ask him to slow down. Yet here, in sync with various racially motivated outlets, cases were made trying to deny that is why he was in the neighborhood at the time.

And then we also have the text that tries to minimize the responsibility of the shooter and those with him.

There is no need to propose some 'agenda' or 'conspiracy' to account for why this story is news. It is news because the persistent inequities black people experience in their interactions with law enforcement and in everyday life has given rise to recognition of it and to people wanting to do something about it, both white and black, on a national scale.

And we need to be very careful not to be drawn into the racist counter response that wants to claim these inequities do not exist and it's all some 'leftist conspiracy'. Let's work instead to help fix the problem - in ourselves by rejecting the sort of racist narratives that have fed some of the responses on these pages - and in our own lives when we have the opportunity to do something about it.

Interesting. I would have made this a separate thread, though, as it is a subject on its own. I may do that when I have time to respond.

[oxmixmudd]

Of course there was a lot more to it than that, but you unwittingly concede the point that this story only rose to prominence because it is useful for advancing a particular narrative even if you have to ignore or downplay certain facts of the case to do so.

Well first, I didnt concede anything. I explained why such a story would rise to prominence in the national news without the presence of some conspiracy or agenda on the part of the news media.

And there is no distortion necessary to see why it is yet another example of the inequities and racist stereotypes that perpetuate the problem, and which ultimately caused this man to die.

[JimL]

Of course there was a lot more to it than that, but you unwittingly concede the point that this story only rose to prominence because it is useful for advancing a particular narrative even if you have to ignore or downplay certain facts of the case to do so.

The story didn't rise to prominence until long after the fact when the cover-up was exposed.

[Ronson]

I'm going to enter this not as a reply, so as not to single out a person or persons here. But the question was raised, why the Arbery case, why not this other case where something bad happened where a young black man abused eldery white people. And so I want to deal with that as a general example of that needs addressing, not as a response to that specific instance.

There are two elements of this I want to address. One is the underlying paranoia that says this other case was ignored because it did not fit a left wing 'agenda'. I can not emphasize enough how destructive this underlying paranoia is to our nation right now. We are a nation divided, and nations(?) external to our own with an interest in dividing us are feeding that paranoia and many others like it. Is this my own 'conspiracy paranoia'?

You are the one using the term "conspiracy." Not me. According to the definition, a "conspiracy" is a secret plan by a group to do something unlawful or harmful. As I said elsewhere, there is no plan so there is no conspiracy. A group of people can do something in conjunction without plotting. If three people on a street all suddenly paint their houses blue, it may look weird or at least like a coincidence, but likely it wasn't planned. They just all like blue, and the paint was available.

The Arbery case is blue paint, it is available, and the media are the people who like the color blue. The weird part is they keep painting their house blue over and over again.

So again, no conspiracy.

No, not at all - It was recently reported that 45 to 60% of the underlying misinformation we see related to covid-19 is being pushed out onto the internet by internet 'bots'. Programs or automatic programs that push certain kinds of information - in this case MIS-information. Specifically inciting self-destructive behaviours. mis-Information about the characteristics of the virus. About wearing masks. About insidious goverment or media 'agendas' related to the existence of the virus and the pandemic.

I would therefore encourage as many of you as possible to take a step back and realize that if you are on the various "it's a conspiracy" bandwagons - including those that might surround this even - realize that in all likelyhood you are being manipulated with misinformation. Take a step back and consult alternate sources, dig into what has caught your fancy and that is feeding whatever paranoia you might have that is vulnerable to what is called 'confirmation bias', that tendency to believe things that confirm what we already believe.

So you are now talking about confirmation bias, and asking people to consult "alternate sources"? This is interesting since three-of-the-four links you just posted are mainstream media (CBS, NPR and Rolling Stone, and all lean left). Most people nowadays don't trust the legacy media without checking their stories against other sources first. The "other" sources are often just anyone or any organization that has a good connection to the particular story. So I don't see anyone just accepting a single source and running with it.

The second element is more directly related to THIS thread: The paranoia that says this story is agenda based and blown out of proportion. First, this case is about a murder. But local murders rarely make national news. There has to be something more to elevate a case to national attention. One is just random chance - some element of the story that pushes it into the national spotlight. In this case that was the emergence of the shooting video itself on may 5. But even more than that, once the story could be seen, there were two other things that had to happen. The first is the underlying injustice associated with how the Georgia law enforcement in this community tried to suppress the event itself, how they did not move, possibly because one of their own was involved, possibly because race was invovled. Either way - the racial element, the mishandling by the prosecutors, pushed this to the attention of the black community itself during a time when - much like #metoo - there has been a series of events that has pushed focus onto the injustice that so many black people experience in terms of unequal treatment under the law and in interactions with law enforcement.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/24/us/ge...ive/index.html

You link to an opinion piece from CNN and you are accusing others of confirmation bias?

I actually argue with my brother on this topic often. He is constantly trying to get me to listen/read his favorite commentators from YouTube and elsewhere, and I just don't. Similarly, why should I care about the opinion of Ray Sanchez on this story? I don't know him. I care more about your opinion because I can at least question you on where you are coming from. Sanchez is just some stranger who has unknown motivations and cannot be questioned.

Phrases that have grown in attention and which have become rallying cries in black communities:

Source: above
Driving while black, BBQing while black, Napping while black, Shopping while black, Waiting while black

© Copyright Original Source

Find in this story another in the list: Jogging while black.

So what we are dealing with is a cultural phenomenon where in black communities the injustice they experience every day took notice of this story as just another in a long line of injustices to black people doing ordinary activities. Jogging while black brings this story to the national attention, and the responses to it. Runners all across the country took a jog of the same approximate distance as Arbery's in solidarity with him. There is a general outcry against this sort of thing across the country, white and black.

As to that underlying racism that has created this entire movement, that has lifted phrases like "Driving while black" and "Jogging while black" to the forefront of the news we need look no further than this thread where attempts have been made in post after post to cast upon this black man the same sorts of racially motivated stereotypes that have given rise to the entire list and the focus itself. Attempts were made to say this man wasn't really 'jogging' when his entire life was marked by athletic prowess as a runner. He was, in fact, a runner, one who nearly every day went out for long jogs and runs. Indeed, as a high school athlete he was so fast his coaches had to ask him to slow down. Yet here, in sync with various racially motivated outlets, cases were made trying to deny that is why he was in the neighborhood at the time.

And then we also have the text that tries to minimize the responsibility of the shooter and those with him.

There is no need to propose some 'agenda' or 'conspiracy' to account for why this story is news. It is news because the persistent inequities black people experience in their interactions with law enforcement and in everyday life has given rise to recognition of it and to people wanting to do something about it, both white and black, on a national scale.

And we need to be very careful not to be drawn into the racist counter response that wants to claim these inequities do not exist and it's all some 'leftist conspiracy'. Let's work instead to help fix the problem - in ourselves by rejecting the sort of racist narratives that have fed some of the responses on these pages - and in our own lives when we have the opportunity to do something about it.

The remainder here is directed at others who are arguing the fine details of this case.

[Mountain Man]

Yeah - he stopped for a break.

On multiple occasions, and often at night.

You are deliberately ignoring the fact that the reason he attracted the McMichaels' attention is because he was caught trespassing and not because he was black. Of course that does not in and of itself justify any of the actions taken against him, but you are assuming a motive for which there is no evidence.

Honestly, the way you are so easily manipulated by the media into jumping to the desired conclusion makes me hope you are never asked to serve on a jury.

[Mountain Man]

I didnt concede anything.

Not deliberately.

[shunyadragon]

On multiple occasions, and often at night.

Yes,according to the homeowner it was a common place in the neighborhood for people to stop for a drink of water as many photos showed on the security monitor. The home owner never objected to this activity, and nothing was ever stolen.

[JimL]

On multiple occasions, and often at night.

You are deliberately ignoring the fact that the reason he attracted the McMichaels' attention is because he was caught trespassing and not because he was black. Of course that does not in and of itself justify any of the actions taken against him, but you are assuming a motive for which there is no evidence.

Is that right? And you know this how? Did the McMichaels and their accomplice chase down and corner all the other visitors to the site as well?

Honestly, the way you are so easily manipulated by the media into jumping to the desired conclusion makes me hope you are never asked to serve on a jury.

Ha! Just the opposite, MM. It's biased thinking like yours that sets murders free. You, not to mention others, but particularly you, were disparaging and accussing Arbery from the get go while looking for excuses for what the McMichaels gang did. If the situation were reversed, I don't doubt for one second that you'd be calling forn the 3 black vigilantes head. You did the same in the Treyvon Martin case, i.e. disparaging Martin as not just some innocent kid with skittles and ice tea.

[Bill the Cat]

Yes,according to the homeowner it was a common place in the neighborhood for people to stop for a drink of water as many photos showed on the security monitor. The home owner never objected to this activity, and nothing was ever stolen.

The why was 911 called, Frank?

[Cow Poke]

Yes,according to the homeowner it was a common place in the neighborhood for people to stop for a drink of water as many photos showed on the security monitor. The home owner never objected to this activity, and nothing was ever stolen.

So, he had security cameras installed to watch people drink water?

[Mountain Man]

Yes,according to the homeowner it was a common place in the neighborhood for people to stop for a drink of water as many photos showed on the security monitor. The home owner never objected to this activity, and nothing was ever stolen.

Source?