Announcement

Collapse

Philosophy 201 Guidelines

Cogito ergo sum

Here in the Philosophy forum we will talk about all the "why" questions. We'll have conversations about the way in which philosophy and theology and religion interact with each other. Metaphysics, ontology, origins, truth? They're all fair game so jump right in and have some fun! But remember...play nice!

Forum Rules: Here
See more
See less

B Theory Of Time...

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by Jim B. View Post
    But why is that the way my brain works? Is it just an anomaly? It's essential to my identity, my "being towards death" etc. If it's just a trick or anomaly, then so am I.
    It would seem like if each moment of my existence is equally real, and I am experiencing a "now" in each moment in which I exist, then there doesn't just exist a single me, but a separate me for each moment of time in which I exist. It doesn't seem to me like the "me" who is typing down this paragraph is the same "me" who is going to click on the "post quick reply button". In fact, it seems to me like the "me" who moved his finger to press down a single key to type a single letter on the screen is different from the "me" who released the key after I was done typing that letter.
    Last edited by JonathanL; 06-02-2020, 04:55 PM.

    Comment


    • The A-theory of time and God's omniscience are not mutually exclusive.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
        The A-theory of time and God's omniscience are not mutually exclusive.
        Please explain, Leonard. And please keep in mind that by omniscience we are talking about knowledge of the future.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Chrawnus View Post
          It would seem like if each moment of my existence is equally real, and I am experiencing a "now" in each moment in which I exist, then there doesn't just exist a single me, but a separate me for each moment of time in which I exist. It doesn't seem to me like the "me" who is typing down this paragraph is the same "me" who is going to click on the "post quick reply button". In fact, it seems to me like the "me" who moved his finger to press down a single key to type a single letter on the screen is different from the "me" who released the key after I was done typing that letter.
          I don't see it necessarily as each moment being equally real, or as identifying my self with each "Now." I'm an ongoing project with a past that remains largely the same but is changing to some extent and that's directed toward a future. But there is some core "me" there that remains the same, as in 'same consciousness'. Otherwise, how could personal pronouns meaningfully refer?

          Comment


          • Originally posted by JimL View Post
            Please explain, Leonard. And please keep in mind that by omniscience we are talking about knowledge of the future.
            But in A-Theory, the future doesn't exist, so God could be ignorant of the future and still be omniscient.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Jim B. View Post
              But in A-Theory, the future doesn't exist, so God could be ignorant of the future and still be omniscient.
              True. But the christian perspective has always been that god knows the future as is fortold in the bible. If he did, then the existence of that knowledge would negate the possibility of free will. One can't change their future actions if in some sense they already exist, B-theory, or if they are already known, omniscience of the future.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by JimL View Post
                True. But the christian perspective has always been that god knows the future as is fortold in the bible. If he did, then the existence of that knowledge would negate the possibility of free will. One can't change their future actions if in some sense they already exist, B-theory, or if they are already known, omniscience of the future.
                If God could foretell the future with absolute certainty, then that isn't A-Theory. If it's A-Theory, the future doesn't exist. Prophecy could still be possible on A-Theory, I think, if God knows all past and present facts and is very good at projecting contingencies and probabilities into the future. Or if God is 'outside' of time as Augustine thought and can timelessly know every A-series event as it happens.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by seer View Post
                  So 2019 still exists in the universe?
                  How many times are you going to keep asking the same questions after I answered you multiple times? No matter what I say, or what Box says, you just repeat yourself. You are starting to sound like Tasman. At this point it is clear to me you just can't grasp the concepts involved in understanding the theory and my time is being wasted trying to explain it to you. Or maybe I am just really bad at explaining things. Either way, we are not getting anywhere and I am getting frustrated at repeating myself over and over. I am just going to ignore your repeated questions at this point.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Jim B. View Post
                    But in A-Theory, the future doesn't exist, so God could be ignorant of the future and still be omniscient.
                    But he couldn't give prophesy of the future where it included the free will actions of human beings. He could prophesy events that he controls though.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Jim B. View Post
                      If God could foretell the future with absolute certainty, then that isn't A-Theory. If it's A-Theory, the future doesn't exist. Prophecy could still be possible on A-Theory, I think, if God knows all past and present facts and is very good at projecting contingencies and probabilities into the future. Or if God is 'outside' of time as Augustine thought and can timelessly know every A-series event as it happens.
                      even if he is really good a "predicting" he could still be wrong. It means we can't trust God's prophesies. Or his prophets.

                      God says he word will always come to pass. No exceptions.

                      Deuteronomy 18:20-22
                      But the prophet who presumes to speak a word in my name that I have not commanded him to speak, or who speaks in the name of other gods, that same prophet shall die.’ And if you say in your heart, ‘How may we know the word that the Lord has not spoken?’— when a prophet speaks in the name of the Lord, if the word does not come to pass or come true, that is a word that the Lord has not spoken; the prophet has spoken it presumptuously. You need not be afraid of him.
                      Last edited by Sparko; 06-04-2020, 07:06 AM.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                        How many times are you going to keep asking the same questions after I answered you multiple times? No matter what I say, or what Box says, you just repeat yourself. You are starting to sound like Tasman. At this point it is clear to me you just can't grasp the concepts involved in understanding the theory and my time is being wasted trying to explain it to you. Or maybe I am just really bad at explaining things. Either way, we are not getting anywhere and I am getting frustrated at repeating myself over and over. I am just going to ignore your repeated questions at this point.
                        Well it is stupid. 1969 no longer exists, that me no longer exists. My friend why died no longer exists. You can't time travel back because there is nothing to travel to.
                        Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by seer View Post
                          Well it is stupid. 1969 no longer exists, that me no longer exists. My friend why died no longer exists. You can't time travel back because there is nothing to travel to.
                          So, your argument is to just assert that the A-theory is true? Basically just hand-wave away any argument because you don't want to believe it?

                          OK I will play.

                          Well that is stupid, 1969 exists in space-time, and if you had a time machine you could travel back to it.

                          There. I win.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                            So, your argument is to just assert that the A-theory is true? Basically just hand-wave away any argument because you don't want to believe it?

                            OK I will play.

                            Well that is stupid, 1969 exists in space-time, and if you had a time machine you could travel back to it.

                            There. I win.
                            No Sparko, you can't travel back in time with B Theory either. Because there is no "back." Time is tenseless, in B Theory, static. There is no distinction between past, present and future. All events are present now as we speak. So if the 1968 me exists you don't go back to find him - you look for him in the here and now. So where is that 1968 me?
                            Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by seer View Post
                              No Sparko, you can't travel back in time with B Theory either. Because there is no "back." Time is tenseless, in B Theory, static. There is no distinction between past, present and future. All events are present now as we speak. So if the 1968 me exists you don't go back to find him - you look for him in the here and now. So where is that 1968 me?
                              It is still "back". Like a ruler, each line has a position - 1 isn't in the same location as 2, it is "back" if you are at 2, you can't find 1 at the same location as 2. You can't find 1969 "here and now" - that's dumb. Seer, are you just acting dumb or do you really not understand the B-theory at all? Because if it's the former, then stop, but if it's the latter then I am wasting my time trying to debate something with someone with no knowledge of the subject. If you can't even grasp my position, then you have no way to argue against it. And thus we just go over the same thing over and over.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                                It is still "back". Like a ruler, each line has a position - 1 isn't in the same location as 2, it is "back" if you are at 2, you can't find 1 at the same location as 2. You can't find 1969 "here and now" - that's dumb. Seer, are you just acting dumb or do you really not understand the B-theory at all? Because if it's the former, then stop, but if it's the latter then I am wasting my time trying to debate something with someone with no knowledge of the subject. If you can't even grasp my position, then you have no way to argue against it. And thus we just go over the same thing over and over.
                                That makes no sense - all the points on the ruler exist simultaneously. Tell me Sparko in B Theory is time tenseless and static?
                                Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

                                Comment

                                Related Threads

                                Collapse

                                Topics Statistics Last Post
                                Started by shunyadragon, 03-01-2024, 09:40 AM
                                161 responses
                                513 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post shunyadragon  
                                Started by seer, 02-15-2024, 11:24 AM
                                88 responses
                                354 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post shunyadragon  
                                Started by Diogenes, 01-22-2024, 07:37 PM
                                21 responses
                                133 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post shunyadragon  
                                Working...
                                X