Originally posted by NorrinRadd
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Trump claims to be taking Hydroxochloroquine
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My brethren, do not hold your faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ with an attitude of personal favoritism. James 2:1
If anyone thinks himself to be religious, and yet does not bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this man’s religion is worthless James 1:26
This you know, my beloved brethren. But everyone must be quick to hear, slow to speak and slow to anger; James 1:19
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Originally posted by NorrinRadd View PostThere are always things I find really odd about the views of my discussion "opponents" (for lack of a better term). Honestly, the idea that Bad Orange Man would be lying about something so simple as taking HCQ has to be one of the weirdest.
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Originally posted by mikewhitney View PostHow could anything get worse than what we actually see in the world right now?
The ironic thing is that the current political scenarios are worse than what conspiracy theories suggested.
1. People are mostly being confined to their homes
2. These people are living in fear for their lives if they go outside
3. There are places in California being threatened with having to be tested for coronavirus and having their children removed if the parents have a positive test
4. Most businesses have been forced to close.
5. Martial law: The governors are acting as dictators, and, even after many months, it sounds like most state legislatures are not able to make decisions on the laws
6. People are happy to obey ridiculous rules
7. People are being asked to snitch on their neighbors
8. The US government is spending trillions of dollars which will cause further collapse and will cause hyper-inflation
9. Police attack people who don't wear nonsensical face masks
10. Censorship has been applied across most large-scale public social sites. Only a few sources are said to be trustworthy: the mass media (sponsored by Pharmaceuticals) and the government
11. We are told to trust Gates, despite the deaths that have resulted from everything he sponsors.
No one I heard had expected such a sudden and total conformity to this global change. So reality is worse than the conspiracy investigators had discussed.My brethren, do not hold your faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ with an attitude of personal favoritism. James 2:1
If anyone thinks himself to be religious, and yet does not bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this man’s religion is worthless James 1:26
This you know, my beloved brethren. But everyone must be quick to hear, slow to speak and slow to anger; James 1:19
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Originally posted by Cow Poke View PostI have a prescription for a drug that's usually used for a totally other purpose, but it has been found to work well with restless leg syndrome, from which I suffer. It's definitely "off-label".
The drug in question, Hydroxochloroquine, has not been effective against the COVID 19, and has been found to cause heart problems and death in older, those with a history of heart illness and fragile patients.Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:
go with the flow the river knows . . .
Frank
I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.
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Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostActually noThe first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.
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Originally posted by Cow Poke View PostActually, yes - I know the drug I'm using and it's labeled use. But, hey, you're always right.Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:
go with the flow the river knows . . .
Frank
I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.
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Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostActually no, drugs that are found to apply to other conditions or illnesses are not "off label."
The drug in question, Hydroxochloroquine, has not been effective against the COVID 19,
Prophylactic use as in the case of Bad Orange Man seems quite variable. I've seen some doctors on TV saying they don't know of anyone doing that, and others saying that everyone at their hospital that can get it is using it. One of the things that led to its use in the first place was the observation that people taking it for RA, lupus, or whatever, seemed to have a lower incidence of Wu-WHO Flu, i.e. that it potentially had prophylactic effects.
and has been found to cause heart problems and death in older, those with a history of heart illness and fragile patients.Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.
Beige Federalist.
Nationalist Christian.
"Everybody is somebody's heretic."
Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.
Proud member of the this space left blank community.
Would-be Grand Vizier of the Padishah Maxi-Super-Ultra-Hyper-Mega-MAGA King Trumpius Rex.
Justice for Ashli Babbitt!
Justice for Matthew Perna!
Arrest Ray Epps and his Fed bosses!
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Originally posted by NorrinRadd View PostThere are always things I find really odd about the views of my discussion "opponents" (for lack of a better term). Honestly, the idea that Bad Orange Man would be lying about something so simple as taking HCQ has to be one of the weirdest.
Honestly, it was the way the words came out of his mouth that made it sound like a lie; an off-topic "oh, by the way..." that he really didn't need to say - except to make himself sound like he was correct in pushing the drug in the first place. The quote was out of place, but definitely in-character.
Hey, who knows, I might be wrong. He might have been telling the truth. The recently released memo suggests that he might be taking it after having talked with his physician. If so, then he didn't lie; it'd be a nice change.
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[QUOTE=NorrinRadd;739590]What is your definition of "off label"?
It has not been conclusively proven effective in randomized controlled trials. Many clinicians in the U.S., Europe, and elsewhere have found it effective enough to have been using it for months.
Prophylactic use as in the case of Bad Orange Man seems quite variable. I've seen some doctors on TV saying they don't know of anyone doing that, and others saying that everyone at their hospital that can get it is using it. One of the things that led to its use in the first place was the observation that people taking it for RA, lupus, or whatever, seemed to have a lower incidence of Wu-WHO Flu, i.e. that it potentially had prophylactic effects.
True-ish. There is debate about how high the incidence is. It can be safely used for decades in RA patients. For Wu-WHO Flu, the recommendation has been to start it when the condition is mild to moderate, and to avoid it in cases of known heart issues, especially particular arrhythmias. The FDC guideline of only using it in hospital settings is likely to lead to showing HCQ to be ineffective, since it is (according to the clinicians who use it) less effective in advanced (i.e. requiring hospitalization) cases.Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:
go with the flow the river knows . . .
Frank
I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.
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Originally posted by oxmixmudd View PostYou forgot about Area 51 aliens and the faked moon landing ...
You have an amazing lack of perception of the very circumstances surrounding you. I suspect that such blindness is probably a severe survival mechnaism working you, a basic denial of reality.
I'm really baffled at your lack of understanding of economics and of so many other areas critical to this era.
If you wake up again, I would suggest that you do a little research on our current situation rather than just blurting out things that you don't know about.
I'm glad that God is ultimately in control. We really do seem to be in the Rev 20:7-10, if you even believe scriptures.
May God bless you.Last edited by mikewhitney; 05-19-2020, 07:57 PM.
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Originally posted by mikewhitney View PostHow could anything get worse than what we actually see in the world right now?
The ironic thing is that the current political scenarios are worse than what conspiracy theories suggested.
1. People are mostly being confined to their homes
2. These people are living in fear for their lives if they go outside
3. There are places in California being threatened with having to be tested for coronavirus and having their children removed if the parents have a positive test
4. Most businesses have been forced to close.
5. Martial law: The governors are acting as dictators, and, even after many months, it sounds like most state legislatures are not able to make decisions on the laws
6. People are happy to obey ridiculous rules
7. People are being asked to snitch on their neighbors
8. The US government is spending trillions of dollars which will cause further collapse and will cause hyper-inflation
9. Police attack people who don't wear nonsensical face masks
10. Censorship has been applied across most large-scale public social sites. Only a few sources are said to be trustworthy: the mass media (sponsored by Pharmaceuticals) and the government
11. We are told to trust Gates, despite the deaths that have resulted from everything he sponsors.
No one I heard had expected such a sudden and total conformity to this global change. So reality is worse than the conspiracy investigators had discussed.
Comment
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Originally posted by JimL View PostAre you an Alex Jones fan, Mike? Because he is the kind of person that push the conspiracy theories that you seem to subscribe to, like Bill Gates being the anti-christ. He and his ilk are making a whole lot of money off you while laughing at you for being so gullible. Nobody wants to admit to themselves that they've been duped by such a one, rather they want to prove to themselves that they haven't been, that they can't be, that they're too smart to be duped. Let me tell you something, it isn't about intelligence, anyone can be duped into believing false stories, and once they have been it gets harder and harder for them to question the validity of their beliefs, to question themselves. There is a whole lot of smart people out there falling for this stuff, a whole lot of dumb people too, but a whole lot of smart people as well. It's not so much a lack of intelligence that allows one to be duped, anyone can be duped under the right circumstances, it's more of a lack of its use that keeps you there. Don't be a dupe, Mike. Use your brain, and I really don't mean to be self righteous, but I know you have one.
There are a lot of smart people who avoid researching information that is readily available. It sounds like you are one of those. So you don't have to feel ashamed. Just start verifying whether these things are true. I cannot believe the intellectual laziness of people who should be interested in facts.
For your "rational" view to be supported, you would have to say there is a conspiracy by Bill Gates, Fauci, WHO and a bunch of other organizations to put false content on their websites just to entice people like me to have false views in opposition to their philanthropy. Is this what you actually which to convey?Last edited by mikewhitney; 05-19-2020, 09:24 PM.
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Originally posted by mikewhitney View PostI don't care for Alex Jones' stuff. I look at the facts. You are gullible enough to call everything conspiracy when you have apparently not investigated people like Gates. And I'm not sure why all of sudden you become so religious you talk about an anti-christ. You assume things without study of anything. I understand that intellectual laziness for people who blindly trust the media and government. I wish you had the intelligence to look into facts. I'm not saying that you should believe anything your read or anything I have talk about, unless you investigate it.
There are a lot of smart people who avoid researching information that is readily available. It sounds like you are one of those. So you don't have to feel ashamed. Just start verifying whether these things are true. I cannot believe the intellectual laziness of people who should be interested in facts.
I'm not saying that I have investigated the things you claim to believe in. I have investigated prior beliefs which bear very similar hallmarks and found them to be false despite having a compelling surface level appeal. What it has done is help instill in me a healthy skepticism for any claim which goes so heavily against mainstream thought. Does that mean that I will mistakenly reject a few outrageous beliefs which don't have much evidence but are nonetheless true? Yes. But it also insulates me from the vast majority of similar claims which aren't true. The vast majority of the time the evidence we have on hand (or which accumulates over time) readily points to what is real in the world.
People want to feel smart. Some are lazy and just don't have what it takes. For those people clinging to fringe beliefs which "prove all the experts wrong" gives them that feeling of power and expertise without actually being experts themselves. That's why there will always be a new breed of what I might call "conspiracy theories" waiting to ensnare the next group. And I'm not immune! I fell hook, line, and sinker for most of the anti-Hillary nonsense in 2016. So I speak from experience.
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Originally posted by DivineOb View PostMike,
I'm not saying that I have investigated the things you claim to believe in. I have investigated prior beliefs which bear very similar hallmarks and found them to be false despite having a compelling surface level appeal. What it has done is help instill in me a healthy skepticism for any claim which goes so heavily against mainstream thought. Does that mean that I will mistakenly reject a few outrageous beliefs which don't have much evidence but are nonetheless true? Yes. But it also insulates me from the vast majority of similar claims which aren't true. The vast majority of the time the evidence we have on hand (or which accumulates over time) readily points to what is real in the world.
People want to feel smart. Some are lazy and just don't have what it takes. For those people clinging to fringe beliefs which "prove all the experts wrong" gives them that feeling of power and expertise without actually being experts themselves. That's why there will always be a new breed of what I might call "conspiracy theories" waiting to ensnare the next group. And I'm not immune! I fell hook, line, and sinker for most of the anti-Hillary nonsense in 2016. So I speak from experience.
Many things must be remembered. These times are not normal. Nothing being implemented has been done before. The economy of the world is dying. The richest people will be the ones to benefit since they can buy stuff at a bargain. The rest of us are just being stupid while hiding in fear in our homes. So, how do you want to evaluate this within the norms that you have become accustom to?Last edited by mikewhitney; 05-19-2020, 09:44 PM.
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Originally posted by mikewhitney View PostOh my. Facts are no longer facts, they are conspiracy theories. You are showing a programmed response instead of making a logical argument. You have been quarantined too long.
You have an amazing lack of perception of the very circumstances surrounding you. I suspect that such blindness is probably a severe survival mechnaism working you, a basic denial of reality.
I'm really baffled at your lack of understanding of economics and of so many other areas critical to this era.
If you wake up again, I would suggest that you do a little research on our current situation rather than just blurting out things that you don't know about.
I'm glad that God is ultimately in control. We really do seem to be in the Rev 20:7-10, if you even believe scriptures.
May God bless you.My brethren, do not hold your faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ with an attitude of personal favoritism. James 2:1
If anyone thinks himself to be religious, and yet does not bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this man’s religion is worthless James 1:26
This you know, my beloved brethren. But everyone must be quick to hear, slow to speak and slow to anger; James 1:19
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