View Poll Results: Who should re-open first, churches or AA meetings?

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  • Places of worship

    2 40.00%
  • AA meetings

    3 60.00%
  • No opinion

    0 0%
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Thread: (Lighter thread): Who should re-open first, churches or AA meetings?

  1. #141
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    Why do you atheists even care about Christians going to church? If they all catch COVID-19 and croak, that is just that many fewer Christians around, amiright?
    But that would be fewer Christians to antagonize!
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  2. #142
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shunyadragon View Post
    This was documented by the home owner.
    No, it was not.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  3. #143
    tWebber shunyadragon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    No, it was not.
    Yes it was.
    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

  4. #144
    tWebber shunyadragon's Avatar
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    Source: https://www.miamiherald.com/news/coronavirus/article242847301.html



    How did 2 people with COVID-19 infect 35? This church offers dramatic lesson, CDC says
    BY BROOKE WOLFORD
    MAY 19, 2020 04:44 PM

    A pastor and his wife held an in-person church service in a rural county in Arkansas back in March, without knowing they were infected with COVID-19, federal officials say.

    Weeks later, it was discovered that 35 of the 92 people who attended the service tested positive for coronavirus and three of them died, according to a new report from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. But it didn’t stop there: Those 35 people went on to infect 26 other community members, one of whom died, the CDC report said.

    The report’s findings add to the growing stack of evidence that large community gatherings, like church services, pose an increased threat to public health during the coronavirus pandemic, even in a community as small as 25,000, according to the CDC.

    The couple attended church events March 6-8 and later developed symptoms like coughing, shortness of breath and fever on March 10 and 11, the CDC report said. Health officials were able to determine that the church attendees spread COVID-19 to others they had contact with in the community through contact tracing, according to the CDC.

    “This outbreak highlights the potential for widespread transmission of SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19, both at group gatherings during church events and within the broader community,” the CDC report said. “These findings underscore the opportunity for faith-based organizations to prevent COVID-19 by following local authorities’ guidance and the U.S. Government’s Guidelines … regarding modification of activities to prevent virus transmission during the COVID-19 pandemic.”

    After the pastor and his wife realized they had contracted the virus, they canceled services, Business Insider reported. The CDC released this report in the context of many churches arguing they should be allowed to reopen, according to Business Insider.

    For example, religious leaders in New York appealed to Gov. Andrew Cuomo to allow faith-based organizations to restart activities and services while enforcing social-distancing practices, Business Insider reported.

    “It’s less about being a church, temple or mosque - it’s more about being a gathering,” Cuomo said, according to Politico. “And that’s basically going to be according to the guidance on large gatherings. Look, large gatherings are where this first started...It was one infected person who went to a couple of events around a religious ceremony. But the last thing you want is 100, 200 people in close proximity.”

    While COVID-19 can be transmitted through infected surfaces, the CDC recently reported that the virus spreads primarily through person-to-person contact and is not as easily spread by touching infected surfaces, Yahoo! News reported.

    © Copyright Original Source

    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

  5. #145
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shunyadragon View Post
    Yes it was.
    Wrong.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  6. #146
    tWebber shunyadragon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    Wrong.
    Source: https://www.miamiherald.com/news/coronavirus/article242847301.html




    How did 2 people with COVID-19 infect 35? This church offers dramatic lesson, CDC says
    BY BROOKE WOLFORD
    MAY 19, 2020 04:44 PM

    A pastor and his wife held an in-person church service in a rural county in Arkansas back in March, without knowing they were infected with COVID-19, federal officials say.

    Weeks later, it was discovered that 35 of the 92 people who attended the service tested positive for coronavirus and three of them died, according to a new report from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. But it didn’t stop there: Those 35 people went on to infect 26 other community members, one of whom died, the CDC report said.

    The report’s findings add to the growing stack of evidence that large community gatherings, like church services, pose an increased threat to public health during the coronavirus pandemic, even in a community as small as 25,000, according to the CDC.

    The couple attended church events March 6-8 and later developed symptoms like coughing, shortness of breath and fever on March 10 and 11, the CDC report said. Health officials were able to determine that the church attendees spread COVID-19 to others they had contact with in the community through contact tracing, according to the CDC.

    “This outbreak highlights the potential for widespread transmission of SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19, both at group gatherings during church events and within the broader community,” the CDC report said. “These findings underscore the opportunity for faith-based organizations to prevent COVID-19 by following local authorities’ guidance and the U.S. Government’s Guidelines … regarding modification of activities to prevent virus transmission during the COVID-19 pandemic.”

    After the pastor and his wife realized they had contracted the virus, they canceled services, Business Insider reported. The CDC released this report in the context of many churches arguing they should be allowed to reopen, according to Business Insider.

    For example, religious leaders in New York appealed to Gov. Andrew Cuomo to allow faith-based organizations to restart activities and services while enforcing social-distancing practices, Business Insider reported.

    “It’s less about being a church, temple or mosque - it’s more about being a gathering,” Cuomo said, according to Politico. “And that’s basically going to be according to the guidance on large gatherings. Look, large gatherings are where this first started...It was one infected person who went to a couple of events around a religious ceremony. But the last thing you want is 100, 200 people in close proximity.”

    While COVID-19 can be transmitted through infected surfaces, the CDC recently reported that the virus spreads primarily through person-to-person contact and is not as easily spread by touching infected surfaces, Yahoo! News reported.

    © Copyright Original Source

    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

  7. #147
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shunyadragon View Post
    [cite=https://www.miamiherald.com/news/coronavirus/article242847301.html]
    You don't even know what you're arguing against.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  8. #148
    tWebber shunyadragon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    You don't even know what you're arguing against.
    Source: https://www.businessinsider.com/church-oregon-largest-coronavirus-outbreak-superspreading-2020-6



    236 people got the coronavirus after an Oregon church held services during lockdown — more evidence that religious gatherings are superspreading hot spots


    A small church in northeastern Oregon has been linked to the state's largest coronavirus outbreak to date.

    State health authorities said this week that more than 230 cases were tied to an outbreak at the Lighthouse Pentecostal Church in Union County, which held services in defiance of Oregon's stay-at-home order.

    The cases contributed to Oregon's second consecutive day of reporting record-high new cases. On Tuesday, the state reported 278 new cases, 94 more than the previous record of 184. The surge prompted Gov. Kate Brown to put a hold on the state's reopening plan for the next week.

    The cluster of cases offers further evidence that gatherings at houses of worship are highly risky when it comes to coronavirus transmission.


    Oregon's church outbreak can be considered a superspreader event, in which one person infects an atypically large number of others. Such events mostly happen indoors when lots of people from different households come into close, extended contact.

    "You can't have a superspreading event unless there are a lot of people around, so you have to be very careful still about gatherings of people of any size — that includes religious services," William Schaffner, an infectious-disease expert from Vanderbilt University, previously told Business Insider.

    More than 60% of churchgoers tested were infected.

    Oregon went into lockdown on March 23, when Brown issued an executive order that prohibited social and recreational gatherings, closed nonessential businesses, and encouraged residents to stay home.

    But the Lighthouse Pentecostal Church held in-person worship services in April and May in violation of Brown's order, according to The Observer. In Union County, a rural area in the northeastern part of the state, gatherings of more than 25 people were banned until June 8.

    © Copyright Original Source

    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

  9. #149
    tWebber shunyadragon's Avatar
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    Source: https://wchstv.com/news/local/covid-19-outbreaks-reported-at-five-churches-in-west-virginia



    Five COVID-19 outbreaks reported at churches in West Virginia

    CHARLESTON, W.Va. (WCHS/WVAH) — Five COVID-19 outbreaks have been confirmed at churches in West Virginia, including 17 cases that have been identified at a church in Greenbrier County.

    Gov. Jim Justice has ordered the National Guard to immediately go to the Greenbrier County church to begin decontamination, and the Guard will be on site Sunday, according to a news release Saturday from the state Department of Health and Human Resources.

    The church has closed for 14 days for cleaning.

    DHHR officials said the other counties that have experienced outbreaks in churches are Boone, Hampshire, Jefferson and Marshall counties. The DHHR said it will not name the churches publicly to protect the possibility of identifying individuals.


    In Greenbrier County, the Greenbrier County Health Department is managing the outbreak with cooperation from the church and contact investigation is underway, the news release said. The DHHR and the National Guard have been asked to help.

    “I want to strongly encourage all West Virginians, especially when in church settings, to follow the guidelines and use every other pew, maintain social distancing, and please wear masks,” Justice said. “A lot of the attendance at our churches are those that are elderly and at higher risk, so we are cautioning everyone to strictly follow our guidelines.”

    The governor said the state “will have stormy seas before we get a vaccine, so it is imperative that we strictly follow the guidelines or the seas will only get rougher.”

    The Greenbrier County Health Department will host free testing events 10 a.m. to 2 p.m. Sunday and Monday at Dorie Miller Park in Lewisburg.

    © Copyright Original Source

    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

  10. #150
    tWebber
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    We have not been told how many of these people tested negative before the church events. So we cannot know how many people transitioned to a positive result.

    We don't know how many of the tests were true positives.

    Nor do we know whether these church groups "violated" social distancing.

    We are not told which people died and whether these people had other conditions that were the likely cause of death.

    We don't know if the case trackers are legitimate. Plus, we have an improper intrusion of these workers into the church.

    There just are not any useful facts to make this of an interest beyond mere propaganda.

    If the virus has not dissipated after 3 months of lock down, we just need to get back to normal while recognizing some risk of living with other people. We have to face the fact that this economic shutdown was the most stupid thing done since the time leading to the worldwide flood. Policy that has not worked for 90 days will not work by prolonging it further.

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