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Thread: Are Police Systematically Racist?

  1. #41
    43rd Mojave Summer DesertBerean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rogue06 View Post
    Not just ammo but high-powered semi-automatic rifles as well.
    That's right.

  2. #42
    Evolution is God's ID rogue06's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    Absolutely, because their standard weaponry at the time was....

    And body armor was not yet standard equipment.
    I don't know if recent advances in body armor have changed this but some of the larger caliber rifles, like .30-06 or .30-30 for instance, tended to punch right through Kevlar vests and the like.

    I'm always still in trouble again

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  3. #43
    Professor and Chaplain Littlejoe's Avatar
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    I found this article echoing the Op-Ed piece published in The Wall Street Journal by Heather Mac Donald, a Thomas W. Smith Fellow at the Manhattan Institute. The statistics are factual:

    A solid body of evidence finds no structural bias in the criminal-justice system with regard to arrests, prosecution or sentencing, Mac Donald writes; rather, crime and suspect behavior, not race, determine most police actions. Mac Donald writes:

    In 2019 police officers fatally shot 1,004 people, most of whom were armed or otherwise dangerous. African-Americans were about a quarter of those killed by cops last year (235), a ratio that has remained stable since 2015. That share of black victims is less than what the black crime rate would predict, since police shootings are a function of how often officers encounter armed and violent suspects. In 2018, the latest year for which such data have been published, African-Americans made up 53% of known homicide offenders in the U.S. and commit about 60% of robberies, though they are 13% of the population.


    It also states that Black officers are more likely than White or Hispanic officers to shoot an unarmed Black suspect.

    A 2015 Justice Department analysis of the Philadelphia Police Department found that white police officers were less likely than black or Hispanic officers to shoot unarmed black suspects. Research by Harvard economist Roland G. Fryer Jr. also found no evidence of racial discrimination in shootings. Any evidence to the contrary fails to take into account crime rates and civilian behavior before and during interactions with police
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  5. #44
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DesertBerean View Post
    Here's an item when they had an anniversary: https://www.dailynews.com/general-ne...ywood-shootout

    I remember a LOT of people were arguing about how badly armed the police was back then. Lots of debate. But afer this shootout, the LA City Council couldn't stop falling all over themselves finding the money to arm their PDs.
    I remember when our department was going through the whole "standard issue" hand gun debate for officers.
    We were issued standard Police .38 revolvers.

    One day, in a city council debate, our Chief asked the city council.....

    OK, so you're a police officer called to the scene of bank robbery, and as you approach, you find yourself face to face with the robber.
    He has a shotgun, and he's turning to point it at you.
    He knows that the penalty for shooting a police officer is no more serious (back then) than his penalty for robbing the bank, if he manages to get away.
    There is nothing to prevent him from shooting you in hopes of fleeing the scene.

    You have a standard issue police .38 cal revolver, which you can shoot multiple times - up to six - and he can still return fire.
    OR, you have the weapon we are requesting - the .357 magnum* - or a .45 semi-auto - which can STOP him in his tracks.

    After some mumbling and grumbling between themselves, they authorized the upgrade.



    *that became our standard duty weapon for awhile, then they began allowing 9 mil semi-auto, or .45s.
    I STILL have my Ruger Security Six .357 revolver which I was allowed to purchase from the department when we subsequently upgraded to the 9 mil as a standard duty weapon.
    I liked the Ruger much better.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  6. #45
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rogue06 View Post
    I don't know if recent advances in body armor have changed this but some of the larger caliber rifles, like .30-06 or .30-30 for instance, tended to punch right through Kevlar vests and the like.
    Yup - ONLY specialized body armor - which is WAY too heavy and bulky for routine patrol - has a chance against a rifle like you mention. The specialized body armor has alloy steel or titanium or ceramic "backup" plates in addition to the kevlar and other composite materials. I do not know a single officer who would volunteer to test it by wearing it and being shot at by a .30-06

    Something else to consider -- no matter how light and compact they make bodyarmor for cops, it STILL has to be resistant to "small arms" fire, and, in Texas, can be incredibly uncomfortable on a hot day.
    That's why there's so often a battle between supervisors and patrol officers about wearing the vests - and why many departments have gone to the "over the shirt" tactical vests instead of the "under the shirt" Kevlar ones.

    body armor then.jpg body armor now.jpg
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  7. #46
    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Here's my thinking...

    People are outraged and protest nearly every time a black person is killed by the police, right? We get demonstrations, sometimes riots, we hear about it on the news, etc.

    If this was a systemic problem, we would all know about it because there would be protests constantly, all year long. The fact that we have a few deaths every few years, shows that it is not a systemic problem but a problem with each death being promoted nationwide through the media and social media.

    It is still a problem. But it isn't common or systemic. Most cops are good. There are a LOT of black cops too. In any organization there will be a few bad people. There are some in the police departments, just like there are some in the demonstrators, those who have been looting and destroying and have killed a couple of black cops already. We shouldn't blame all of the protestors for the actions of the bad ones, just like we shouldn't be blaming all police for the actions of the bad ones.

  8. Amen Cow Poke, RumTumTugger amen'd this post.
  9. #47
    Evolution is God's ID rogue06's Avatar
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    I'm always still in trouble again

    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
    "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

  10. Amen Cow Poke, RumTumTugger amen'd this post.
  11. #48
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    Here's my thinking...

    People are outraged and protest nearly every time a black person is killed by the police, right? We get demonstrations, sometimes riots, we hear about it on the news, etc.

    If this was a systemic problem, we would all know about it because there would be protests constantly, all year long. The fact that we have a few deaths every few years, shows that it is not a systemic problem but a problem with each death being promoted nationwide through the media and social media.

    It is still a problem. But it isn't common or systemic. Most cops are good. There are a LOT of black cops too. In any organization there will be a few bad people. There are some in the police departments, just like there are some in the demonstrators, those who have been looting and destroying and have killed a couple of black cops already. We shouldn't blame all of the protestors for the actions of the bad ones, just like we shouldn't be blaming all police for the actions of the bad ones.
    Funny how everyone here forgets how they behaved during the lockdowns. Letting prisoners from jail while arresting ordinary citizens for the most frivolous things imaginable.
    "I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole, it was like... we had entire training courses. It reminds you of the glory of the American experiment." - Mike Pompeo, Secretary of State (source).

  12. #49
    tWebber Ronson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by seanD View Post
    Funny how everyone here forgets how they behaved during the lockdowns. Letting prisoners from jail while arresting ordinary citizens for the most frivolous things imaginable.
    I haven't forgotten. My drug-addicted stepson showed up unexpectedly on my doorstep, out of the blue. Within a week he overdosed on heroin at his in-laws' house (survived it though).

    I don't know where he is now, probably looting.

  13. #50
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronson View Post
    I haven't forgotten. My drug-addicted stepson showed up unexpectedly on my doorstep, out of the blue. Within a week he overdosed on heroin at his in-laws' house (survived it though).

    I don't know where he is now, probably looting.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  14. Amen seanD amen'd this post.

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