Floyd Tested Positive for Covid

[Littlejoe]

I find it very hard to believe the Floyd's family lawyer is actually calling for first degree murder. I'm no lawyer, but just from a basic understanding of what premeditation is, I'm pretty sure you could never prove that in this case. Maybe the lawyer is just pandering to the emotions of the family, knowing that would actually be a foolhardy idea in legal terms.

It's a common tactic if Minnesota is like Texas, they charge him with several levels of a crime at the same time which gives the jury options to convict on a lesser charge while the DA still looks good by charging him with the max charge (as well as several lesser ones).

[oxmixmudd]

I wondered if this wasn't personal...making it not racism. They worked security together at a night club FWIU, you don't do that without knowing your co-workers fairly well...unless one of them was a pretty recent new hire.

Personal and racism are not mutually exclusive. I would be surprised if the fact they knew each other can nullify the racial aspect of what happened. But it does make it more conpkex.

[Whateverman]

I find it very hard to believe the Floyd's family lawyer is actually calling for first degree murder. I'm no lawyer, but just from a basic understanding of what premeditation is, I'm pretty sure you could never prove that in this case.

Why?

I've seen nothing so far to suggest this was premeditated, but why would it near impossible to prove?

[seanD]

Why?

I've seen nothing so far to suggest this was premeditated, but why would it near impossible to prove?

Because Chauvin had no control over the circumstances leading up to his contact with Floyd.

Second degree:

Joe sees Ryan across the street, remembers they both had a beef, so Joe runs across the street and beats Ryan to death with his cane.

First degree:

Joe breaks into Ryan's house, waits for Ryan to get home from work, then beats Ryan to death with his cane when Ryan walks through his front door.

[Mountain Man]

Second degree murder looking strong...

Prosecution would still need to prove malice aforethought.

[Whateverman]

Because Chauvin had no control over the circumstances leading up to his contact with Floyd.

That we know of.

I don't believe it was premeditated, but then again, I don't know much about any information that's not been made public yet. Maybe Chauvin has a diary in which he wrote details of how he'd kill Floyd if he had the chance. Maybe one of his buddies tipped Chauvin off that they had Floyd in custody.

And maybe not.

We don't know, either way - which is why an understanding of premeditation doesn't give us enough information to know whether anyone can legally prove Chauvin planned on committing murder or not.

[Littlejoe]

"...while intentionally inflicting or attempting to inflict bodily harm upon the victim..."

Well, yeah, that would be the "malice aforethought" part of the equation. The question is, can the prosecutors prove intent to cause bodily harm? If he was using a common restraint method that was not disallowed by his department then he may have a valid defense, at least against a murder charge.

Before the peanut gallery jumps in to declare that I'm trying to justify the officer's actions, I feel the need to point out that I'm talking from a purely legal perspective. Morally, I think what he did was cruel and indefensible.

I"m going to disagree with you here, you can intentionally inflict or attempt to inflict bodily harm in the heat of the moment...

[Littlejoe]

Personal and racism are not mutually exclusive. I would be surprised if the fact they knew each other can nullify the racial aspect of what happened. But it does make it more conpkex.

Ok that's valid, they aren't mutually exclusive. I should have worded that better...but ISTM that people who have a relationship are less likely to react out of racism in my experience but you're right, it's still plausible.

[Mountain Man]

I"m going to disagree with you here, you can intentionally inflict or attempt to inflict bodily harm in the heat of the moment...

Then that would be a crime of passion rather than something done with malice aforethought. Successfully arguing a crime of passion doesn't exonerate a defendant, but it can reduce the charges against him.

But I'm not even sure it applies to this case. I don't think the officer was emotionally out of control, and I don't think he was intending to harm the suspect, but he did show a disregard for his well-being, so it's clearly manslaughter, but I don't think it's murder.

[seanD]

Prosecution would still need to prove malice aforethought.

He's on the Floyd's neck for over 8 minutes while Floyd is claiming multiple times he can't breath. The other officers request to move him on his side, Chauvin denies the request. Chauvin keeps his knee on Floyd's neck, even when Floyd is unconscious the moment the medic arrives and has to actually nudge Chauvin off to get to Floyd. I can't think of any possible reason to justify that. Then when you make the connection of Floyd and Chauvin in the club together with witnesses saying there was animosity between them... I'm no defense attorney, but that seems pretty open and shut. But who knows what a defense attorney can come up with, so yeah.

[seanD]

Second degree murder looking strong...

Retract...

[Mountain Man]

Retract...

Report first, confirm later... that's modern journalism for you.

I didn't think the story sounded right, because there was such of recognition between the men in the video I watched.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

I have actually tried to "devil's advocate" this case, and I can't, in my wildest imagination, come up with any justification for what Chauvin did. I almost have to believe there was bad blood between Chauvin and Floyd from their common job, but we don't know that.

It struck me at the time I first heard about it, how apposite was the police officer's surname. Chauvin - to wit the legendary, and probably apocryphal, French soldier Nicolas Chauvin whose family name became the by-word for excessive nationalism and is now used for any bigotry or prejudice e.g. male chauvinism.

[Mountain Man]

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/mattve...illed-n2570522