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Thread: Did the Jews really kill Jesus?

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    tWebber Hypatia_Alexandria's Avatar
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    Did the Jews really kill Jesus?

    For you, brothers {and sisters,} became imitators of the churches of God in Christ Jesus that are in Judea, for you suffered the same things from your own compatriots as they did from the Jews, who killed both the Lord Jesus and the prophets, and drove us out; they displease God and oppose everyone by hindering us from speaking to the Gentiles so that they may be saved. Thus they have constantly been filling up the measure of their sins; but God’s wrath has overtaken them at last.

    1st Thessalonians, 2: 14-16 (NRSV)


    This NT passage would appear to support the view that Paul himself actually believed that they did in fact do so, but is such a viewpoint historically credible?

    The statement is widely considered by many modern commentators and historians [quite correctly in my opinion] as a later interpolation into the original text of the letter - the mentioning of divine wrath upon the Jews being seen as a reference to the fall of Jerusalem and the destruction of its temple by the Roman army in 70 CE - Paul being, in all probability, dead by this date.

    Does this extract merely reflect and lend credence to the markedly anti-Semitic tone of the gospel passion narratives, or was the historical situation in fact something rather different?

    Was the condemnation and execution of Jesus of Nazareth merely a routine Roman administrative process for dealing with messianic agitators accused of sedition or had this Galilean holy man committed any offence against Jewish religious law, and if he had done so, would a Roman military governor be cognisant of such matters?
    "Fables should be taught as fables, myths as myths, and miracles as poetic fantasies."

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    tWebber
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    The other question to ask is whether Jews did anything to prevent the death of their Messiah. This is not an indictment against Jews of all ages, yet the question is still relevant for the first half of the first century.

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    tWebber Hypatia_Alexandria's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikewhitney View Post
    The other question to ask is whether Jews did anything to prevent the death of their Messiah. This is not an indictment against Jews of all ages, yet the question is still relevant for the first half of the first century.
    For which you are relying solely on the four canonical gospels, presumably?
    "Fables should be taught as fables, myths as myths, and miracles as poetic fantasies."

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    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
    For which you are relying solely on the four canonical gospels, presumably?
    There's a whole Bible available.

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    tWebber Hypatia_Alexandria's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikewhitney View Post
    There's a whole Bible available.
    The Hebrew bible does not deal with the execution of a first century Jew.
    "Fables should be taught as fables, myths as myths, and miracles as poetic fantasies."

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    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Spoiler alert!


    He didn't stay dead.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

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    tWebber Hypatia_Alexandria's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    Spoiler alert!


    He didn't stay dead.
    That is a Christian belief. There is no evidence that it occurred.
    "Fables should be taught as fables, myths as myths, and miracles as poetic fantasies."

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    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
    That is a Christian belief. There is no evidence that it occurred.
    A) Welcome to Tweb
    2) There is no evidence that you will accept.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

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    tWebber Hypatia_Alexandria's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    A) Welcome to Tweb
    2) There is no evidence that you will accept.
    Thank you. I think you will find there is no evidence, apart from the writing of Paul and of the later gospel writers.
    "Fables should be taught as fables, myths as myths, and miracles as poetic fantasies."

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    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
    Thank you. I think you will find there is no evidence, apart from the writing of Paul and of the later gospel writers.
    If you were a sincere seeker, I'd love to have this conversation with you, as I have had with many others before.

    Meanwhile, we best stop winking at one another, or somebody might get the wrong impression.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  11. Amen Christianbookworm amen'd this post.

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