A New Religion

[Thoughtful Monk]

I thought about put this is in New Segregation but decided it's a bit broader. The article is long https://www.realclearpolitics.com/ar...ry_143426.html I'm not sure it's helpful that the author calls it neo-Marxist. I think it's a little broader than that.

I believe that man is made to worship and if he won't worship God, he'll find something else. (and since you have to say it these days, I'm using man in the sense of all humanity.) The article argues that politics is the new religion with some vague priesthood that controls the doctrines.

As I look at this new religion, I am also struck by how unforgiving it is. If it was branch of Christianity, I'd call Hellfire and Brimstone preaching. It's also very forceful in it's conversations. I hope it someday matures to the point that most of Christianity has learned that you can't force conversation and have them be meaningful.

I'm not sure where to go with this. God's Church is eternal and unaffected by this new rival. I guess I'm more concerned with me and how I respond, how do I lead in my family on this, and what does the local church body do?

For me, I think I need to overcome my fear of being attacked for my beliefs and be willing to take a stand for them.

For the local church, I think they have to develop a description of God that is more than God is love, that life is more than how to be comfortable, and more willingness to be right rather than popular.

[mikewhitney]

I have thought for awhile that we were in the era where Satan was released to deceive the nations -- per Rev 20:7-10. I was uncertain how we would see a broad deception come upon the world -- until I saw the worldwide response of the nations to this coronavirus. Additionally, the people likewise responded in fear. Now I heard that a big number of protestors are white people (especially a great number of young women). I saw the level of deception strongly in stuff I heard and saw concerning the communist-style revolt of the students at Evergreen State College in Oregon. (The Evergreen situation is a microcosm of what is now happening. See videos at this youtube channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/BenjaminABoyce)

To be sure, the Revelation passage talks about the nations gathering together and encircling the camp of the saints. This passage does not require that a war happen but only that the nations be poised against the Christians. This is the sort of deception I have anticipated. The current deception only had to be augmented with a focus against Christians. I don't even see this representing a physically identifiable army -- but probably was only described figuratively in this sense. (If people all over the world are protesting with an anti-Christian mindset, this would suffice to match the prophecy.)

Another part of this deception may also be about the expectation of the mark of the beast (which may have been a first century situation). People are interpreting this as a future (or current?) situation, especially relating to barcodes or chips. I could be wrong on seeing most of Revelation completed in the first century -- and these interpretations may then be correct. It is this last news from your post that really highlights how people can now be turned against Christianity.

[Thoughtful Monk]

I have thought for awhile that we were in the era where Satan was released to deceive the nations -- per Rev 20:7-10. I was uncertain how we would see a broad deception come upon the world -- until I saw the worldwide response of the nations to this coronavirus. Additionally, the people likewise responded in fear. Now I heard that a big number of protestors are white people (especially a great number of young women). I saw the level of deception strongly in stuff I heard and saw concerning the communist-style revolt of the students at Evergreen State College in Oregon. (The Evergreen situation is a microcosm of what is now happening. See videos at this youtube channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/BenjaminABoyce)

To be sure, the Revelation passage talks about the nations gathering together and encircling the camp of the saints. This passage does not require that a war happen but only that the nations be poised against the Christians. This is the sort of deception I have anticipated. The current deception only had to be augmented with a focus against Christians. I don't even see this representing a physically identifiable army -- but probably was only described figuratively in this sense. (If people all over the world are protesting with an anti-Christian mindset, this would suffice to match the prophecy.)

Another part of this deception may also be about the expectation of the mark of the beast (which may have been a first century situation). People are interpreting this as a future (or current?) situation, especially relating to barcodes or chips. I could be wrong on seeing most of Revelation completed in the first century -- and these interpretations may then be correct. It is this last news from your post that really highlights how people can now be turned against Christianity.

Mike, you make many good points. I agree that Satan and his devils are out in the world causing trouble. It something I don't hear as much about these days. While we have many problems in the world, Satan is certainly working to make them worse.

You make an interesting point about the world being united without a war being present. This is certainly different from much of the teach I can recall on this subject. I think you have a good point here.

The question I struggle with is: once you have an idea of what is going on, how do you respond? the obvious answer is to pray on it. Does anyone have an insight on how a church body should respond? I think many of the forms we have gotten use to are about to be changed.

[mikewhitney]

I think there is a bit of a catch-22.

The first thing is the potential good news. If this is the Rev 20:7-10 situation, it means that this will remove the instigators of the deception and chaos. From what I can tell, Satan is there to attract evil so that the instigators of evil are exposed. But in doing this Satan also has done and promoted evil. So, his removal would indicate a new phase of our existence where this no longer is an issue. Churches would do well to be informed of this or of looking at things from people expecting bar codes or whatever. I think the deceipt involves matching these expectations of the apocalpytic events. However, we don't know how long this era of deception would last.

We still have to wonder what the Christians need to know about the circumstances. I think we Christians need to do some normal actions in response to the situations --but without going crazy trying to respond to everything. It doesn't seem helpful to repent from things we have not done --but we still can ask God to reveal our own hearts. If there is anything to show unity across various ethnic groups. I liked being in a church group years ago that had people from across the world.
If Christians knew the deception, it might help them and it may help solve the problems. However, it seems that people are asleep which may mean this is the situation that we will remain in until the deception is over.

The catch-22 is that the effort to calm the situation down may be perceived as the bad attitude of the church ... of the Christians' lack of sympathy (as perceived by many people educated into communist ideology).

[Thoughtful Monk]

I think there is a bit of a catch-22.

The first thing is the potential good news. If this is the Rev 20:7-10 situation, it means that this will remove the instigators of the deception and chaos. From what I can tell, Satan is there to attract evil so that the instigators of evil are exposed. But in doing this Satan also has done and promoted evil. So, his removal would indicate a new phase of our existence where this no longer is an issue. Churches would do well to be informed of this or of looking at things from people expecting bar codes or whatever. I think the deceipt involves matching these expectations of the apocalpytic events. However, we don't know how long this era of deception would last.

We still have to wonder what the Christians need to know about the circumstances. I think we Christians need to do some normal actions in response to the situations --but without going crazy trying to respond to everything. It doesn't seem helpful to repent from things we have not done --but we still can ask God to reveal our own hearts. If there is anything to show unity across various ethnic groups. I liked being in a church group years ago that had people from across the world.
If Christians knew the deception, it might help them and it may help solve the problems. However, it seems that people are asleep which may mean this is the situation that we will remain in until the deception is over.

The catch-22 is that the effort to calm the situation down may be perceived as the bad attitude of the church ... of the Christians' lack of sympathy (as perceived by many people educated into communist ideology).

There's all at least two sides to an issue. We certainly could be moving into the Revelation 20:7-10 scenario. Personally, I don't think so. I've found that USA Christians who do care about end-times tend to believe that the USA will be exempt from persecution. I don't believe that since I don't see any Scripture passage that supports that view. I think the persecution is coming to America and soon.

I agree that Christians need to know more about the circumstances and how to respond. The better churches I've attended over the years have been more racially integrated. But I think Christians need to start realizing that being Christian doesn't mean having a comfortable life. Our church leadership has failed by too often preaching belief in God and all will be comfortable. That's going to end and be painful.

For the current situation, I have no idea how to respond. I certainly have no influence on the situation and I do feel that anything I do will result in my being condemned.

[mikewhitney]

I do wish the church messages were more on topic to the situations going on. I sort of mix the coronavirus thing with the protestors and riots stuff.

The thing that bothers me most is the lack of insight into the forces at work in this world. I don't just want a sermon on how to be happy through this. Most eschatological messages wouldn't be very useful either. We'll see how the church messages go -- it certainly is an odd situation to figure out.

[Thoughtful Monk]

I think we're in agreement that the members of the church are being poorly served by the leadership of the church who are not teaching and preaching on the spiritual anymore.