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BLM and MLK - not so much

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  • #31
    It does matter if elections officials are racist because that casts a pall over the legitimacy of elections. In North Carolina, the state Republican Party was caught discussing their gerrymandering specifically aimed at black voters... to say that this doesn't matter because there will always be racism is cynicism that I don't see a reason a Christian should accept.
    "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

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    • #32
      Originally posted by whag View Post
      No, I simply mean MLK understands why riots happen,
      He's dead, you know.

      while you seem to be threatened by it.
      I really wish you guys would stop this dishonest debate crap. I am not "threatened" by riots, but I can't see any justification for burning and looting, PARTICULARLY when the burning and looting is against the very people that should be upset.

      I expect pastors
      The gratuitous dig

      to be a little more informed about what happens when the consequences of evil national acts carry over to the next generation and sick societies crumble.
      Left unchecked, it leads to anarchy.

      Isn’t this what you were expecting as a pastor who preaches on eschatology?
      Well (time to brag again ) I don't just talk, I do.
      The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by Ronson View Post
        People shouldn't feel threatened by riots?
        I'm not - so far - cause our community doesn't do that. yet
        The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
          It does matter if elections officials are racist because that casts a pall over the legitimacy of elections. In North Carolina, the state Republican Party was caught discussing their gerrymandering specifically aimed at black voters... to say that this doesn't matter because there will always be racism is cynicism that I don't see a reason a Christian should accept.
          The fact that he had the gall to ask why it mattered says much about why the problem of brazen racism persists.

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
            It does matter if elections officials are racist because that casts a pall over the legitimacy of elections. In North Carolina, the state Republican Party was caught discussing their gerrymandering specifically aimed at black voters... to say that this doesn't matter because there will always be racism is cynicism that I don't see a reason a Christian should accept.
            The fact she made it public makes it doubtful she'll do anything underhanded. And if she does, that just makes her culpable. But the fact she's racist doesn't validate BLM and their lie that racism is nationally systemic. That was whag's point posting it in this thread. Racism is a thing. Systemic racism is not a thing. You guys are confusing the two.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by seanD View Post
              The fact she made it public makes it doubtful she'll do anything underhanded. And if she does, that just makes her culpable. But the fact she's racist doesn't validate BLM and their lie that racism is nationally systemic. That was whag's point posting it in this thread. Racism is a thing. Systemic racism is not a thing. You guys are confusing the two.
              Do you believe systemic racism was ever a thing? How about in the 50s?

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              • #37
                Originally posted by whag View Post
                Do you believe systemic racism was ever a thing? How about in the 50s?
                Definitely, up to the 70s even when Biden was working with southern white supremacists to oppose desegregation. That's when actual racist policy was being instituted.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                  In North Carolina, the state Republican Party was caught discussing their gerrymandering specifically aimed at black voters... to say that this doesn't matter because there will always be racism is cynicism that I don't see a reason a Christian should accept.
                  Do you think they would try to gerrymander those districts if blacks voted mostly Republican? Of course not, again, it is not about race but politics. And BTW both sides gerrymander when they are in power.
                  Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

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                  • #39
                    Some in the Left-leaning media are starting to come to their senses. They're actually looking at (gasp) the statistics!

                    https://www.usatoday.com/story/opini...mn/3235072001/

                    There is no epidemic of fatal police shootings against unarmed Black Americans
                    Ideally officers would never need to take anyone's life. But the data on police killings doesn't support reducing or abolishing law enforcement.
                    Heather Mac DonaldOpinion contributor
                    The video of George Floyd’s tragic death under the knee of a Minneapolis police officer has led many to ask whether it represents the tip of an iceberg of police brutality. For centuries, United States law enforcement was interwoven with slavery and segregation, and that memory cannot be easily erased. But the evidence does not support the charge that biased police are systematically killing Black Americans in fatal shootings.

                    Much of modern policing is driven by crime data and community demands for help. The African American community tends to be policed more heavily, because that is where people are disproportionately hurt by violent street crime. In New York City in 2018, 73% of shooting victims were Black, though Black residents comprise only 24% of the city’s population.


                    Nationally, African Americans between the ages of 10 and 34 die from homicide at 13 times the rate of white Americans, according to researchers from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and the Justice Department.

                    Community requests also determine police deployment, and the most urgent requests often come from law-abiding residents of high-crime neighborhoods.

                    An elderly resident in the Mount Hope neighborhood of the Bronx once described to me her fear of entering her building lobby, since it was so often occupied by trespassing youth hanging out and selling drugs. The only time she felt safe was when law enforcement was around: As long as she saw the police, she told me, everything is OK. You can come down and get your mail and talk to decent people...
                    ... more ...

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Ronson View Post
                      Some in the Left-leaning media are starting to come to their senses. They're actually looking at (gasp) the statistics!

                      https://www.usatoday.com/story/opini...mn/3235072001/

                      There is no epidemic of fatal police shootings against unarmed Black Americans
                      Ideally officers would never need to take anyone's life. But the data on police killings doesn't support reducing or abolishing law enforcement.
                      Heather Mac DonaldOpinion contributor
                      The video of George Floyd’s tragic death under the knee of a Minneapolis police officer has led many to ask whether it represents the tip of an iceberg of police brutality. For centuries, United States law enforcement was interwoven with slavery and segregation, and that memory cannot be easily erased. But the evidence does not support the charge that biased police are systematically killing Black Americans in fatal shootings.

                      Much of modern policing is driven by crime data and community demands for help. The African American community tends to be policed more heavily, because that is where people are disproportionately hurt by violent street crime. In New York City in 2018, 73% of shooting victims were Black, though Black residents comprise only 24% of the city’s population.


                      Nationally, African Americans between the ages of 10 and 34 die from homicide at 13 times the rate of white Americans, according to researchers from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and the Justice Department.

                      Community requests also determine police deployment, and the most urgent requests often come from law-abiding residents of high-crime neighborhoods.

                      An elderly resident in the Mount Hope neighborhood of the Bronx once described to me her fear of entering her building lobby, since it was so often occupied by trespassing youth hanging out and selling drugs. The only time she felt safe was when law enforcement was around: As long as she saw the police, she told me, everything is OK. You can come down and get your mail and talk to decent people...
                      ... more ...
                      Facts are racist.

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Ronson View Post
                        Some in the Left-leaning media are starting to come to their senses. They're actually looking at (gasp) the statistics!

                        https://www.usatoday.com/story/opini...mn/3235072001/

                        There is no epidemic of fatal police shootings against unarmed Black Americans
                        Ideally officers would never need to take anyone's life. But the data on police killings doesn't support reducing or abolishing law enforcement.
                        Heather Mac DonaldOpinion contributor
                        The video of George Floyd’s tragic death under the knee of a Minneapolis police officer has led many to ask whether it represents the tip of an iceberg of police brutality. For centuries, United States law enforcement was interwoven with slavery and segregation, and that memory cannot be easily erased. But the evidence does not support the charge that biased police are systematically killing Black Americans in fatal shootings.

                        Much of modern policing is driven by crime data and community demands for help. The African American community tends to be policed more heavily, because that is where people are disproportionately hurt by violent street crime. In New York City in 2018, 73% of shooting victims were Black, though Black residents comprise only 24% of the city’s population.


                        Nationally, African Americans between the ages of 10 and 34 die from homicide at 13 times the rate of white Americans, according to researchers from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and the Justice Department.

                        Community requests also determine police deployment, and the most urgent requests often come from law-abiding residents of high-crime neighborhoods.

                        An elderly resident in the Mount Hope neighborhood of the Bronx once described to me her fear of entering her building lobby, since it was so often occupied by trespassing youth hanging out and selling drugs. The only time she felt safe was when law enforcement was around: As long as she saw the police, she told me, everything is OK. You can come down and get your mail and talk to decent people...
                        ... more ...
                        This has been demonstrated again and again, over and over. Studies that looked into this keep finding that if you are white and get into an altercation with the police you are more likely to get killed than if you're black. That this is the case is why studies are now trying to determine why this is the case.

                        Posted this while the Ferguson shooting was still hot
                        Originally posted by rogue06 View Post


                        Only one problem with that. Blacks who only constitute 13% of the population commit nearly 50% of the crime. So one can concluded that police confrontations are roughly equal. And yet, whites are more likely to be killed as a result of such a confrontation. This has been confirmed by research conducted at the John Jay College of Criminal Justice at the City University of New York, which shows that approximately 49% of those killed by officers from May 2013 to April 2015 were white, while 30% were black.

                        Likewise, a study by Washington State University-Spokane's Department of Criminal Justice and Criminology concluded that police "were less likely to erroneously shoot unarmed black suspects than they were unarmed whites — 25 times less likely" as well as "officers hesitated significantly longer before shooting armed suspects who were black, compared to armed subjects who were white or Hispanic."

                        ProPublica, which has won two Pulitzer Prizes (the first online news organization to win one) along with several other awards, conducted a similar study utilizing FBI data from 1980-2012 and came to similar conclusions.

                        PolitiFact looked into the claim and used statistics provided by the CDC and concluded that 2151 whites died by being shot by police compared to 1130 blacks between 1999 and 2011.

                        Again, keep in mind, since blacks are essentially responsible for half of the violent crimes committed in the U.S. there is going to be roughly an equal number of confrontations. And if you believe the hype from black activists that blacks are far more likely (one claimed something like ten times more likely) to be stopped by the police, then blacks have more encounters with the police in total meaning that these statistics are even more startling.

                        I guess we should be expecting massive protests about how "White Lives Matter" any day now.

                        And the Washington Times recently ran this:

                        Source: Police kill more whites than blacks, but minority deaths generate more outrage


                        Nobel Prize-winning novelist Toni Morrison says she wants to see an officer shoot an unarmed white teenager in the back before agreeing that the “conversation about race” is over, but she almost certainly already has received her wish.

                        An analysis released last week shows that more white people died at the hands of law enforcement than those of any other race in the last two years, even as the Justice Department, social-justice groups and media coverage focus on black victims of police force.

                        ...

                        Meanwhile, the deaths of whites at the hands of law enforcement typically receive less attention, even when the case is shrouded in controversy. For example, Gilbert Collar, an 18-year-old white student at the University of South Alabama, was shot and killed while naked, unarmed and under the influence of drugs by a black police officer.

                        The officer, Trevis Austin, was cleared of wrongdoing in 2013 by a Mobile County grand jury in a case that received little media coverage outside Alabama. Mr. Collar’s parents filed a federal lawsuit last year against the officer.

                        As researchers are quick to point out, FBI data on police shootings by race is notoriously incomplete, which may explain why Peter Moskos, assistant professor at the John Jay College of Criminal Justice at the City University of New York, decided to use figures from the website Killed by Police.

                        Based on that data, Mr. Moskos reported that roughly 49 percent of those killed by officers from May 2013 to April 2015 were white, while 30 percent were black. He also found that 19 percent were Hispanic and 2 percent were Asian and other races.

                        His results, posted last week on his blog Cop in the Hood, arrived with several caveats, notably that 25 percent of the website’s data, which is drawn largely from news reports, failed to show the race of the person killed.

                        Killed by Police lists every death, justified or not, including those in which the officer had been wounded or acted in self-defense.

                        “The data doesn’t indicate which shootings are justified (the vast majority) and which are cold-blooded murder (not many, but some). And maybe that would vary by race. I don’t know, but I doubt it,” Mr. Moskos said on his blog.

                        Adjusted to take into account the racial breakdown of the U.S. population, he said black men are 3.5 times more likely to be killed by police than white men. But also adjusted to take into account the racial breakdown in violent crime, the data actually show that police are less likely to kill black suspects than white ones.

                        “If one adjusts for the racial disparity in the homicide rate or the rate at which police are feloniously killed, whites are actually more likely to be killed by police than blacks,” said Mr. Moskos, a former Baltimore cop and author of the book “Cop in the Hood.”

                        “Adjusted for the homicide rate, whites are 1.7 times more likely than blacks die at the hands of police,” he said. “Adjusted for the racial disparity at which police are feloniously killed, whites are 1.3 times more likely than blacks to die at the hands of police.”

                        Mr. Moskos listed two possible reasons for the racial disparity. The first is that police assigned to largely black neighborhoods face “more political fallout when they shoot, and thus receive better training and are less inclined to shoot.”

                        The second is that police assigned to black communities with high crime rates are more accustomed to dangerous situations and thus are more likely to be able to resolve them without resort to lethal force.

                        Figures on police shootings by race are thin on the ground, but Mr. Moskos’s results have some support: The investigative journalism website ProPublica came up with a similar percentage in an Oct. 10 article, reporting that 44 percent of all those killed by police were white, using FBI data from 1980 to 2012.

                        The fact-checking website PolitiFact concluded in August 2014 that police kill more whites than blacks after the claim was made by conservative commentator Michael Medved. PolitiFact cited data from the Centers for Disease Control on fatal injuries by “legal intervention” from 1999 to 2011.

                        “Over the span of more than a decade, 2,151 whites died by being shot by police compared to 1,130 blacks. In that respect, Medved is correct,” said PolitiFact.

                        But PolitiFact gave his assertion a “half true” rating because whites make up 63 percent of the population, while blacks make up just 12 percent.

                        “Yes, more whites than blacks die as a result of an encounter with police, but whites also represent a much bigger chunk of the total population,” PolitiFact said in its Aug. 21 post.

                        But PolitiFact did not take into account the percentage of those by race involved in violent crime or shootings of police, as Mr. Moskos did.

                        Despite the recent flood of media coverage involving police shootings, Mr. Moskos advised his readers to “keep all this morbidity in perspective,” reminding them that very few people, white or black, will ever be shot or killed by police.

                        “The odds that any given black man will shoot and kill a police officer in any given year is slim to none, about one in a million. The odds for any given white man? One in four million,” he said. “The odds that a black man will be shot and killed by a police officer is about 1 in 60,000. For a white man those odds are 1 in 200,000.”



                        Source

                        © Copyright Original Source



                        Wrt the last statistic, a recent study that a black person living in Chicago has an 1.13 in 1000 chance of being shot. Period. Funny how groups like Black Lives Matter and liberal politicians aren't up in arms (no pun intended) about this. But then they can't blame whites, or the police or give their typical knee jerk reaction of demanding stricter gun control since Chicago already has some of the toughest gun laws in the country.

                        Here's an article for the left to studiously ignore: 5 Statistics You Need To Know About Cops Killing Blacks

                        I'm always still in trouble again

                        "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                        "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                        "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

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