Conservative values/principles

[whag]

In trying to define what somebody is - like "conservative" - we can get so granular that we can't agree on a specific point.

So, let's give this a start, and see if other conservatives agree with these points.

1. Transcendent Order
2. Social Continuity3. Prescription
4. Prudence

Fourth, conservatives are guided by their principle of prudence. Burke agrees with Plato that in the statesman, prudence is chief among virtues. Any public measure ought to be judged by its probable long-run consequences, not merely by temporary advantage or popularity. Liberals and radicals, the conservative holds, are imprudent: for they dash at their objectives without giving much heed to the risk of new abuses worse than the evils they hope to sweep away. Human society being complex, remedies cannot be simple if they are to be effective. The conservative declares that he acts only after sufficient reflection, having weighed the consequences. Sudden and slashing reforms are perilous as sudden and slashing surgery. The march of providence is slow; it is the devil who always hurries.

5. Variety

Fifth, conservatives pay attention to the principle of variety. They feel affection for the proliferating intricacy of long-established social institutions and modes of life, as distinguished from the narrowing uniformity and deadening egalitarianism of radical systems. For the preservation of a healthy diversity in any civilization, there must survive orders and classes, differences in material condition, and many sorts of inequality. The only true forms of equality are equality in the Last Judgment and equality before a just court of law; all other attempts at leveling lead, at best, to social stagnation. Society longs for honest and able leadership; and if natural and institutional differences among people are destroyed, presently some tyrant or host of squalid oligarchs will create new forms of inequality. Similarly, conservatives uphold the institution of private property as productive of human variety: without private property, liberty is reduced and culture is impoverished.

6. Imperfection

Is patriotism related to any of these?

[Cow Poke]

Is patriotism related to any of these?

Wow.... is the color blue related to roller skates?

I think "Patriotism" is a whole 'nuther discussion. If it's defined as "love and devotion to one's country", that would depend on what one thought their country should be like.

Seriously, I think that would be a whole 'nuther thread.

[Whateverman]

Seer never insulted you once.

I never claimed otherwise.

He just showed you specifically where you're wrong.

That never happened. He merely expressed an opinion, which doesn't in any way show that I said something wrong.

The left hates [...]

This thread is about conservative traits/characteristics. Go whine about liberals in your own thread

[37818]

Conservative values are a spectrum of values.
Under life, liberty and happiness. Among other values.

[Thoughtful Monk]

Is patriotism related to any of these?

I would go with somewhere in Social Continuity. Celebrate the country that makes it possible.

[37818]

Conervatism is not forgetting true history.

[LeaC]

My broad, simplistic understanding of conservatism vs liberalism is that conservatives tend to idealize the past or the "status quo" and liberals tend to idealize the future. In a healthy society both perspectives are necessary, but either can go too far when they stop listening to the other side. And in the current debates, liberals have ventured far from valuing freedom and free exchange of ideas and are firmly pushing toward tyranny.

[Leonhard]

I'm reminded of Chesterton who refused to call himself conservative or progressive.

Source: G.K Chesterton

The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected. Even when the revolutionist might himself repent of his revolution, the traditionalist is already defending it as part of his tradition. Thus we have two great types -- the advanced person who rushes us into ruin, and the retrospective person who admires the ruins. He admires them especially by moonlight, not to say moonshine. Each new blunder of the progressive or prig becomes instantly a legend of immemorial antiquity for the snob. This is called the balance, or mutual check, in our Constitution.

© Copyright Original Source

[whag]

I'm reminded of Chesterton who refused to call himself conservative or progressive.

Source: G.K Chesterton

The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected. Even when the revolutionist might himself repent of his revolution, the traditionalist is already defending it as part of his tradition. Thus we have two great types -- the advanced person who rushes us into ruin, and the retrospective person who admires the ruins. He admires them especially by moonlight, not to say moonshine. Each new blunder of the progressive or prig becomes instantly a legend of immemorial antiquity for the snob. This is called the balance, or mutual check, in our Constitution.

© Copyright Original Source

[whag]

My broad, simplistic understanding of conservatism vs liberalism is that conservatives tend to idealize the past or the "status quo" and liberals tend to idealize the future. In a healthy society both perspectives are necessary, but either can go too far when they stop listening to the other side. And in the current debates, liberals have ventured far from valuing freedom and free exchange of ideas and are firmly pushing toward tyranny.

[whag]

Wow.... is the color blue related to roller skates?

I think "Patriotism" is a whole 'nuther discussion. If it's defined as "love and devotion to one's country", that would depend on what one thought their country should be like.

Seriously, I think that would be a whole 'nuther thread.

[Cow Poke]

Yes sir, I thought about that some more. Since conservatives resist radical change, we tend to be proud of what we have. Especially in these days, we're seeing conservatives wanting to keep our police departments, law and order, the founding principles of our country.... we're proud of America as the greatest nation on the face of the earth.

Liberals, however, seem to want to morph into Venezuela or Europe or some other country or 'vision'.

[carpedm9587]

Seer never insulted you once. He just showed you specifically where you're wrong. The left hates free speech when they disagree with it and this has been abundantly demonstrated. But instead of a factual rebuttal, you omit that part of his post (like the slimy dishonest way you always do), hand wave what he said and just pull OP rank over him.

But when you and MM do it - it's just because you are trying to focus on the subject at hand...?

[carpedm9587]

I'm reminded of Chesterton who refused to call himself conservative or progressive.

Source: G.K Chesterton

The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected. Even when the revolutionist might himself repent of his revolution, the traditionalist is already defending it as part of his tradition. Thus we have two great types -- the advanced person who rushes us into ruin, and the retrospective person who admires the ruins. He admires them especially by moonlight, not to say moonshine. Each new blunder of the progressive or prig becomes instantly a legend of immemorial antiquity for the snob. This is called the balance, or mutual check, in our Constitution.

© Copyright Original Source

I love it...

[carpedm9587]

Yes sir, I thought about that some more. Since conservatives resist radical change, we tend to be proud of what we have. Especially in these days, we're seeing conservatives wanting to keep our police departments, law and order, the founding principles of our country.... we're proud of America as the greatest nation on the face of the earth.

Liberals, however, seem to want to morph into Venezuela or Europe or some other country or 'vision'.

There are several problems with the emphasized part. First - we really aren't anymore, and I'm not sure we ever were. Don't get me wrong - we've had some amazing moments in history, and done some amazing things. But this level of pride is, in my experience, largely blind to the negative aspects of this country. What we are unwilling to examine because it might somehow require us to revise this "greatest nation on the face of the earth" view we will never be able to adjust/correct. Second, it is an amazingly arrogant view. It is the equivalent of Trump's self-aggrandizement on a national scale. I think our nation could use a bit more humility, and willingness to recognize it's flaws as well as its strengths. We are quick to tout the latter and slow to embrace the former. Finally, it is a view the rest of the world is no longer tolerant of. Despite all the of the recent resurgence of "nationalism," the fact is we are a nation within a global context, and globalism is a growing force. There is no reversing this reality. The moment we bound the world together with the telegraph, and then the telephone, and then high-speed international travel, and most recently with the Internet, the impact of one nation on another and on the whole was magnified. We can respond to that reality - and adjust our stance accordingly, or we can huddle in our nationalistic shells and the world will pass us by. What happens on the other side of the world can now impact us quickly and with significant effect. We need only look to the coronavirus to see that force in action.