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Thread: How do you attempt to rationalise with the completely irrational?

  1. #11
    tWebber seer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
    I appreciate your laconic indifference but why in a society where serious and rational information is, quite literally, at our fingertips do these ridiculous conspiracy theories continue to flourish and whatever happened to common sense?

    The six minute video suggests that such beliefs are more prevalent among older people. I assume that refers to people of my generation who were born in the 50s/60s and whom one would have hoped should have garnered a degree of rational thinking. Whatever went wrong?
    This is called being a human being, and we see it on the left too. Trans ideology, Critical Race theory, White Fragility, Systemic Police racism, etc...
    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

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    tWebber Whateverman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
    It is laughable but also quite terrifying that people can believe such absolute nonsense.
    Your thread title is timely for me personally.

    My niece is married to a great guy. Her homeilife wasn't great, and Joe's was much worse, but he literally swept her off her feet, and has been a fantastic addition to my extended family. He works hard, makes great money, and is a genuinely nice guy who's got a good head on his shoulders.

    Yesterday, Joe posted a news story from RT.com on his Facebook page. It was about some journalist working with CNN being found to be a real scum bag...

    I like Joe, so when I tactfully asked why he reads US news from Russia, I was surprised to see him get defensive very quickly. He began talking about Democrats and liberal media, fake news - almost everything except his implicit endorsement of Russian state propaganda. I had to find ways of bringing him back to my question with insulting him or his POV - and I'm still working on it.

  3. #13
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whag View Post
    My 79 yo mom was a died-in-the-wool liberal up until around 2014. By then, she started watching QAnon and naturally gravitated to Trump.
    How in the world did I get to be nearly that age, and don't know QAnon from Al-anon?
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  4. Amen whag, NorrinRadd amen'd this post.
  5. #14
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whateverman View Post
    Your thread title is timely for me personally.

    My niece is married to a great guy. Her homeilife wasn't great, and Joe's was much worse, but he literally swept her off her feet, and has been a fantastic addition to my extended family. He works hard, makes great money, and is a genuinely nice guy who's got a good head on his shoulders.

    Yesterday, Joe posted a news story from RT.com on his Facebook page. It was about some journalist working with CNN being found to be a real scum bag...

    I like Joe, so when I tactfully asked why he reads US news from Russia, I was surprised to see him get defensive very quickly. He began talking about Democrats and liberal media, fake news - almost everything except his implicit endorsement of Russian state propaganda. I had to find ways of bringing him back to my question with insulting him or his POV - and I'm still working on it.
    With all due respect, does Joe think the same of you? He's rational and you're the irrational?
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  6. Amen NorrinRadd amen'd this post.
  7. #15
    tWebber whag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rogue06 View Post
    Possibly for the same reason that, IIRC, nearly 40% of those on the left still believe that the Collusion Delusion happened. IOW, they want to believe it and troublesome things like facts, evidence and truth are impediments to be ignored.
    That’s probably because Trump’s ties with Russia are deep and that sometimes corruption just can’t be prosecuted. The Clintons are a good example. Tons of shadiness on Whitewater and other scandals, but Starr couldn’t prosecute them despite the obvious wrongdoing.

    You’ll find that the right is more prone to conspiracy. Very few liberals believe that that natural science is driven by hoax and black magic. The preponderance of people who believe in global conspiracies are conservatives.

  8. Amen Whateverman amen'd this post.
  9. #16
    tWebber seer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oxmixmudd View Post
    ....thus they can't be trusted to be honestly evaluating the data according to the principles and methodology we call science.
    Remember the scientific method and rationality are racist...
    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

  10. #17
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by oxmixmudd View Post
    One reason is that many of the rational sources are themselves not trusted within those circles that buy into the conspiracies. The anti-vaxers, the young earth creationists, the AGW deniars, they all have been convinced that scientists are themselves engaged in 'covering up' the truth or perhaps that they have been 'bought out' or somehow forced to be silent about what the 'really know' and thus they can't be trusted to be honestly evaluating the data according to the principles and methodology we call science.
    As ideological encroachment corrupts scientific establishments, one would possibly marvel why extra scientists aren’t defending the onerous sciences from this intrusion. The reply is that many lecturers are afraid, and for good purpose. They’re hesitant to disagree with scientific management teams, and so they see what has occurred to scientists who do. They see how researchers lose funding if they’ll’t justify how their analysis applications will explicitly fight claimed systemic racism or sexism, a requirement for scientific proposals now being utilized by granting companies.
    I had no idea Lawrence Krauss was an anti-vaxxer, AGW denier creationist. Heck, I didn't even know he was a Christian.
    "I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole, it was like... we had entire training courses. It reminds you of the glory of the American experiment." - Mike Pompeo, Secretary of State (source).

  11. Amen Cow Poke, NorrinRadd amen'd this post.
  12. #18
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    Conspiracy theories are comforting because they provide a neat explanation when things are spiraling out of control. And they're rhetorically difficult to dismiss out of hand because real conspiracies *have* occurred. (Some are easy to dismiss out of hand, like the Wayfair nonsense; that politicians are secret space aliens, etc., but I mean categorically).
    "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

  13. Amen ReformedApologist amen'd this post.
  14. #19
    Evolution is God's ID rogue06's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by seer View Post
    Remember the scientific method and rationality are racist...
    A few decades ago some Ivy League professor proclaimed that linear logic was racist.

    I'm always still in trouble again

    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
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  15. #20
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingsGambit View Post
    Conspiracy theories are comforting because they provide a neat explanation when things are spiraling out of control. And they're rhetorically difficult to dismiss out of hand because real conspiracies *have* occurred. (Some are easy to dismiss out of hand, like the Wayfair nonsense; that politicians are secret space aliens, etc., but I mean categorically).
    Hey, now, I saw Men in Black, and it's REAL!
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

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