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Congressman Louie Gohmert gets tested positive for COVID-19

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  • Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post
    The problem is that they don't delete the positive test when this happens.
    And, according to my hospice nurse daughter who is very familiar with the process, the multiple positive results on the same patient report as a new case [new patient] each time.

    One patient gets tested 5 times - that's 5 "cases".
    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post
      Actually, my oldest does COVID testing, and she said the exact opposite. False positives far outweigh false negatives in her lab. They intentionally run 2 swabs per patient just to account for expected false positives because of the nature of the control substance used. She explained it to us this weekend, but it went pretty far over my head. I don't do lab terminology very much.
      but, do her eyes glaze over when you try to explain encapsulation of ones and zeroes?
      The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post
        Actually, my oldest does COVID testing, and she said the exact opposite. False positives far outweigh false negatives in her lab. They intentionally run 2 swabs per patient just to account for expected false positives because of the nature of the control substance used. She explained it to us this weekend, but it went pretty far over my head. I don't do lab terminology very much.
        Here's what MIT says:
        July 21, 2020

        How accurate is the diagnostic test for COVID-19?

        The PCR test for COVID-19 works by detecting genetic material from SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19. The genetic material from SARS-CoV-2 cannot be confused with the genetic material from other viruses, so the COVID-19 diagnostic test is highly specific. This means it almost never gives a false positive. If you are tested for COVID-19, and the test comes back positive, you can be very sure that you are infected with this virus. The new antigen test for COVID-19 is also very specific and rarely gives a false positive.

        Unfortunately, neither test is equally sensitive. If the specimen collection is not done perfectly, or if you are in an early stage of infection or already partially recovered, your nasal-swab sample might not contain enough viral material to come back positive. There are many stories about patients who tested negative soon after their symptoms began, only to test positive on a test done later. It is clear that the PCR test is more accurate at detecting early-stage infections, and there are early indications that the antigen test may be better at identifying patients who are already recovering.

        However, because false negative results on diagnostic tests happen relatively often, a negative result should not give you a sense of false security. If you have any symptoms of COVID-19, it is safest to assume you are infected and act accordingly, even if your diagnostic test comes back negative.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
          And, according to my hospice nurse daughter who is very familiar with the process, the multiple positive results on the same patient report as a new case [new patient] each time.

          One patient gets tested 5 times - that's 5 "cases".
          Most places are working to avoid reporting duplicates.

          https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/coronavi...cated/2416120/

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Stoic View Post
            Most places are working to avoid reporting duplicates.

            https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/coronavi...cated/2416120/
            When you say "most places", that's not very comforting. How many "duplicates" are already in the system? There is such inconsistency in the way reporting is handled, it's no surprise that so many people just aren't buying the numbers.
            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
              When you say "most places", that's not very comforting. How many "duplicates" are already in the system? There is such inconsistency in the way reporting is handled, it's no surprise that so many people just aren't buying the numbers.
              If you think about it, there's a lot of political pressure to minimize the number of cases reported. Local officials want everyone to think they are doing a good job of controlling the virus, and they want to be able to open up their economies. The last thing they want to do is report more cases than they have.

              As for duplicates already in the system, they are even going back and correcting those.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Stoic View Post
                If you think about it, there's a lot of political pressure to minimize the number of cases reported.
                As well as a whole lot of political pressure to maximize the number of cases reported.

                Local officials want everyone to think they are doing a good job of controlling the virus, and they want to be able to open up their economies. The last thing they want to do is report more cases than they have.
                Perhaps you're overlooking the $$$$ component.

                As for duplicates already in the system, they are even going back and correcting those.
                How do you know that?
                The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Stoic View Post
                  Here's what MIT says:
                  July 21, 2020

                  How accurate is the diagnostic test for COVID-19?

                  The PCR test for COVID-19 works by detecting genetic material from SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19. The genetic material from SARS-CoV-2 cannot be confused with the genetic material from other viruses, so the COVID-19 diagnostic test is highly specific. This means it almost never gives a false positive. If you are tested for COVID-19, and the test comes back positive, you can be very sure that you are infected with this virus. The new antigen test for COVID-19 is also very specific and rarely gives a false positive.

                  Unfortunately, neither test is equally sensitive. If the specimen collection is not done perfectly, or if you are in an early stage of infection or already partially recovered, your nasal-swab sample might not contain enough viral material to come back positive. There are many stories about patients who tested negative soon after their symptoms began, only to test positive on a test done later. It is clear that the PCR test is more accurate at detecting early-stage infections, and there are early indications that the antigen test may be better at identifying patients who are already recovering.

                  However, because false negative results on diagnostic tests happen relatively often, a negative result should not give you a sense of false security. If you have any symptoms of COVID-19, it is safest to assume you are infected and act accordingly, even if your diagnostic test comes back negative.
                  Just spoke with her again. She said the following:

                  "The PCR test is very reliable. Both false positives and false negatives are extremely rare (as in .02% or less). The sensitivity of their machine is calibrated to detect tiny amounts of the virus. And if the machines are mis-calibrated, the controls will let them know to retest.So, unless the person is actually not shedding virus nasally, or the swab was done improperly, it will be captured. But that's a collection error, not a testing false negative. The rapid tests, on the other hand, have about a 5% false positive ratio, and that's why our lab quit processing them"
                  That's what
                  - She

                  Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
                  - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

                  I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
                  - Stephen R. Donaldson

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post
                    Just spoke with her again. She said the following:

                    "The PCR test is very reliable. Both false positives and false negatives are extremely rare (as in .02% or less). The sensitivity of their machine is calibrated to detect tiny amounts of the virus. And if the machines are mis-calibrated, the controls will let them know to retest.So, unless the person is actually not shedding virus nasally, or the swab was done improperly, it will be captured. But that's a collection error, not a testing false negative. The rapid tests, on the other hand, have about a 5% false positive ratio, and that's why our lab quit processing them"
                    That is pretty much consistent with what I've posted. The PCR tests are rarely wrong, the antigen tests are faster but not as accurate. But in each case, false negatives greatly outweigh false positives.

                    The only disagreement I have with what she said is that false negatives can be caused by collection errors, and by the fact that there may not be enough viral material in the specimen in the early stages of infection, or during recovery. Her definition of "false negative" is too narrow. I would define a "false negative" as when you are infected, but the lab report says you aren't.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                      As well as a whole lot of political pressure to maximize the number of cases reported.
                      I seriously doubt that anyone at the county level is willing to take a hit with their own numbers in order to screw the other party at the national level.

                      Perhaps you're overlooking the $$$$ component.
                      Maybe, but I'd need to see evidence that money has had a serious impact on the numbers.

                      How do you know that?
                      From the article I linked:
                      As of June 1, Collin County switched to using DSHS to manage new case reporting and investigations. They download the numbers from the Texas Health Trace System.

                      The county said it discovered about 150 confirmed cases that were possible duplicates and transfers. The county started correcting the issue and working with DSHS to fix the problem.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Stoic View Post
                        That is pretty much consistent with what I've posted. The PCR tests are rarely wrong, the antigen tests are faster but not as accurate. But in each case, false negatives greatly outweigh false positives.

                        The only disagreement I have with what she said is that false negatives can be caused by collection errors, and by the fact that there may not be enough viral material in the specimen in the early stages of infection, or during recovery. Her definition of "false negative" is too narrow. I would define a "false negative" as when you are infected, but the lab report says you aren't.
                        Just relaying how her lab categorizes their findings.
                        That's what
                        - She

                        Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
                        - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

                        I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
                        - Stephen R. Donaldson

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post
                          Just relaying how her lab categorizes their findings.
                          From the point of view of the lab, it makes perfect sense. They are naturally most concerned about the things they have control over.

                          But from a public perspective, the accuracy of the lab tests themselves is only a small part of it.

                          Comment

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