The Strong Horse

[seer]

No.

Then what is?

[seer]

The bottom line of what?

In like all that matters in the end.

[seer]

Don't call what moral?

You said: If you wish to adopt that moral position that's your choice. Evolution doesn't say anything about morality. Morals are an agreed upon set of rules that a society tries to live by. What is considered moral has varied tremendously over time and with different cultures.

I said OK, we won't use moral terms. So isn't survival the only thing that matters in the end?

[phank]

Well that did not deal with what I asked.

Subsequent discussion makes it clear that it DOES address what you asked. You are looking for simple, neat, ultimate answers. Something like "survival is all that matters". But the world is complex, human motivations are complex, social systems are complex. Religion provides simple answers, which is what you demand.

[seer]

Subsequent discussion makes it clear that it DOES address what you asked. You are looking for simple, neat, ultimate answers. Something like "survival is all that matters". But the world is complex, human motivations are complex, social systems are complex. Religion provides simple answers, which is what you demand.

OK, so in the end survival is not all that matters? Then what does? And I said nothing about religion.

[HMS_Beagle]

OK, so in the end survival is not all that matters? Then what does? And I said nothing about religion.

Matters to who, or what?

[seer]

Matters to who, or what?

To creatures...

[HMS_Beagle]

To creatures...

Which creatures? You're making zero sense here.

[phank]

OK, so in the end survival is not all that matters? Then what does? And I said nothing about religion.

Look, you can't say something "matters" without a context. What matters to you isn't what matters to me, nor to my cat.

[seer]

Which creatures? You're making zero sense here.

So survival doesn't matter to you? What matters more, especially in a godless universe?

[seer]

Look, you can't say something "matters" without a context. What matters to you isn't what matters to me, nor to my cat.

You don't think survival would matter to your cat, if it could talk. It doesn't matter to you? What matters more?

[Method]

In like all that matters in the end.

Living a life that benefits your family, friends, and community would seem to matter more. Look at how many soldiers die in the name of protecting their country.

[JonF]

That question from you has been answered so many times it's obvious you are incapable of comprehending it. Yet the bottom line is no.

[HMS_Beagle]

So survival doesn't matter to you? What matters more, especially in a godless universe?

It depends on the circumstances. If I were stranded on a desert island with my pet dog and had to eat the dog to prevent starving to death I'd do it. But I also wouldn't hesitate to sacrifice my life if it meant the survival of my wife and child.

Someone already pointed out that soldiers sacrifice their lives quite readily to defend their country.

If you're trying to make some lame "gotcha" point against evolution you're failing badly.

[seer]

Living a life that benefits your family, friends, and community would seem to matter more. Look at how many soldiers die in the name of protecting their country.

Yes, so survival of the group is all that matters in the end. So what ISIL is doing may be a good evolutionary strategy. Nothing wrong with that - right.