Will You Go on Record

[klaus54]

when you answer someone like that, you seem to be making it LOOKS LIKE PEOPLE DODGE YOUR QUESTION.

I think you've done this before.

are you not seeing all the posts?

is "the god of this world' actually for real blinding you" or something?

I responded to in in POST 83

the curse / the fall ...whatever you want to call it.

if you are doing this on purpose, trying to make it look like nobody answers your questions or even tries, then stop it, it is a dishonest tactic.

Me be thanking you.

So YEC Bible God cursed the entire Universe and hundreds of generations of innocents with pain and physical death 'Cuz Ish and Ishah noshed on a piece of forbidden fruit.

It's possible that the Garden Story is metaphorical for humanity becoming moral agents, responsible for cruel and yucky acts.

That's what many modern Bible scholars would say -- or something on that order.

But YEC Bible God doesn't allow that interpretation 'Cuz then all them gobs and gobs of evidence of deep time, deep history, and evilution couldn't be rejected out of hand giving his cult followers a modicum of credibility and not opening up Christianity for Dawkinsian strawman ridicule.

The Real God would allow that interpretation. The Real God wouldn't curse all of physical Creation for biting a fruit. The Real God wouldn't create a fictional universe that seems to any intelligent human to be a product of deep time and cosmic and biological evolution. The Real God wouldn't play such a nasty, nasty trick AND He wouldn't subject His Creation to all the all that cruelty and blame it on two people who were in a state of innocence and duped by the supernaturally-intelligent serpent.

But YEC Bible God does that.

YEC Bible God darkens the minds of those caught in his cultic trap.

YEC Bible God makes a mockery of truth and all that is good.

YEC Bible God bad.

YEC Bible God makes Richard and Christopher and Ward happy.

YEC Bible God also makes Jorge and JR and Cerebrum and Mr. Black happy.

Me no likely YEC Bible God.

K54

[lilpixieofterror]

He doesn't win. When he responds with generic insults or dismissals, and provides no cogent points, he loses.

In his mind and method, he does 'win'.

[phank]

In his mind and method, he does 'win'.

True, but this is the "black knight" problem, wherein every appendage can be whacked off, and the head will still be proclaiming victory until it dies.

When axioms battle evidence, the deciding factor is political. Science will never abandon evidence in favor of superstition, and the superstitious will never even understand the concept of evidence. Look around at the world's various political systems, and see the various results of each approach being supported by physical power.

[jordanriver]

The Real God would allow that interpretation. The Real God wouldn't curse all of physical Creation . . . . . . .

K54

? you're making this up aren't you. I bet you just made all that god up. I don't see that god recorded in any sources anywhere, no the Mahabharata or the Ramayana or the Bhagavad Gita or the Quran or the Mesopotamian Inanna and her friends or the Norse gods, or the Iliad or Virgil's Aeneid or the MesoAmerican gods or the North American Native gods ... ??

I think you just made that up.

I think you reject the God reported in The Bible , because you think They are made up,
. . . . so what do you do?

YOU TURN RIGHT AROUND AND BELIEVE IN A GOD YOU MADE UP,
....and in this case you know its made up because you are the one who made it up.




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give me an honest to goodness atheist any old day.

at least they don't make up a god out of their wishful imagination.

a Happy Happy Joy Joy god does not jive with reality.





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I don't see a third option:

I see option 1. if there is a God , He must be pretty mad at us, (its such a sinful evil race of humans based on WORLD HISTORY) . . . . but hopefully has a PLAN to reconcile us with Him.

OR
. . . .option 2. based on the suffering, there probably is no God.


. . . . . I don't a third option, I don't see a god who is not mad at humans, but is going to let them suffer anyway.

[Jorge]

Fair enough. You hold a religious position, not a scientific one, and there's no scientific evidence conceivable that will make you change your mind. Pretty much what Ken Ham said in his debate with Bill Nye.

Any other YECs want to weigh in?

What for, Beagle "Duffus" Boy? Why would any YEC waste his time on you?

The ONLY evidence that would convince you -- because you wouldn't have
any choice -- is if God Himself 'whacked' you across the forehead with a
two-by-four and even then you might concoct some sort of story.

Oh, and before I forget, you ALSO hold a religious position.
The thing is that people like you refuse to admit this.
By placing yourself on a "scientific pedestal" you grant yourself a
"superior status, above the ignorant, superstitious ..."

Get a clue, Beagle Boy!

You don't accept/believe God's account because you don't WANT to.
And nothing that any of us can provide for you will change that.

Jorge

[klaus54]

What for, Beagle "Duffus" Boy? Why would any YEC waste his time on you?

The ONLY evidence that would convince you -- because you wouldn't have
any choice -- is if God Himself 'whacked' you across the forehead with a
two-by-four and even then you might concoct some sort of story.

Oh, and before I forget, you ALSO hold a religious position.
The thing is that people like you refuse to admit this.
By placing yourself on a "scientific pedestal" you grant yourself a
"superior status, above the ignorant, superstitious ..."

Get a clue, Beagle Boy!

You don't accept/believe God's account because you don't WANT to.
And nothing that any of us can provide for you will change that.

Jorge

"Why would a rational scientifically-literate person spend time on a YEC?" is the more incisive question.

Who can make any intellectual progress with one who has already made up his/her mind? In particular, one who is immune to contradictory data?

YECs project their ignorance and their lithified ideology, and you are the master Projectionist of them all.

Hail the Great One!!!

K54

P.S. Can you do some shadow puppets for us? Perhaps a Kent Hovind one?


film-projector.jpg

[klaus54]

? you're making this up aren't you. I bet you just made all that god up. I don't see that god recorded in any sources anywhere, no the Mahabharata or the Ramayana or the Bhagavad Gita or the Quran or the Mesopotamian Inanna and her friends or the Norse gods, or the Iliad or Virgil's Aeneid or the MesoAmerican gods or the North American Native gods ... ??

I think you just made that up.

I think you reject the God reported in The Bible , because you think They are made up,
. . . . so what do you do?

YOU TURN RIGHT AROUND AND BELIEVE IN A GOD YOU MADE UP,
....and in this case you know its made up because you are the one who made it up.




@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@


give me an honest to goodness atheist any old day.

at least they don't make up a god out of their wishful imagination.

a Happy Happy Joy Joy god does not jive with reality.





@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@




I don't see a third option:

I see option 1. if there is a God , He must be pretty mad at us, (its such a sinful evil race of humans based on WORLD HISTORY) . . . . but hopefully has a PLAN to reconcile us with Him.

OR
. . . .option 2. based on the suffering, there probably is no God.


. . . . . I don't a third option, I don't see a god who is not mad at humans, but is going to let them suffer anyway.

How about the selfish animal nature of humans resulting from our evolutionary ancestry ("Red in Tooth and Claw") is antithetical to our spiritual nature?

But then God as the Emmanuel visits humanity via the Incarnation and suffers with us as well as redeems us?

One ideological issue with the YEC Bible God worshipers is that they focus too much on a Theology of Glory rather than a Theology of the Cross.

This is a lot better than reifing the metamorphical curse on all descendants of the Garden Ish and Ishah via biting the Forbidden Fruit.

And a perusal of the mockery YECs make of physical reality shows the abject ignorance of this approach -- a grotesquely heretical approach IMO.

K54

[HMS_Beagle]

The ONLY evidence that would convince you -- because you wouldn't have
any choice -- is if God Himself 'whacked' you across the forehead with a
two-by-four and even then you might concoct some sort of story.

Another YEC admits his position is purely religious, not scientific, and no amount of evidence will change his preconceived views. No surprise here as el poll grande has never understood the science behind ToE.

[Leonhard]

Or do you good luck with the part about finding a Coney in the Cambrian?

Finding a mammal in the Cambrian.

[Jorge]

Originally Posted by lilpixieofterror:
I mostly did that just to show how big of a hypocrite Jorge really is. If you give him a point by point answer, he does something like that. If you don't give him a point by point answer, he accuses you of dodging his points. No matter what, he wins.

He doesn't win. When he responds with generic insults or dismissals, and provides no cogent points, he loses.

I'm having a hellish time deciding which of the above two dim-witted
Dodo's is the most dishonest. Is it Terror or Roy? Very hard to say.

Jorge

[Jorge]

Another YEC admits his position is purely religious, not scientific, and no amount of evidence will change his preconceived views. No surprise here as el poll grande has never understood the science behind ToE.

Every time - EVERY TIME !!! - that you open your mouth you merely corroborate
what most people suspect - that you're a babbling idiot crazed in drunken stupor.
So why do you keep opening your mouth? ANSWER: because, like the scorpion
in the old story, it's your nature to do so.

Jorge

[Roy]

not sure if I am young earth creationist, (what is a "day" to God?)
But Bible is plain, humans do not have non-human ancestors.

But if you want EVIDENCE acceptable to me,
....SHOW ME IN THE BIBLE.

the Bible the Bible the Bible the Bible'

ok I think that's pretty plain answer.

It is. Is there any evidence that would convince you the bible may not be true?

Roy

[jordanriver]

It is. Is there any evidence that would convince you the bible may not be true?

Roy

Yes.
Prove the resurrection of Jesus Christ never occurred.

[Roy]

Yes.
Prove the resurrection of Jesus Christ never occurred.

What evidence would be necessary to prove that to you? Or even allow you consider the possibility?

Roy

[jordanriver]

What evidence would be necessary to prove that to you? Or even allow you consider the possibility?

Roy

Find His corpse.

Anywhere, it doesn't have to be in the precambrian or anything like that.