Homeschooling Defined and Defended

[Eglerio_i_hir]

Why is homeschooling good? There are several reasons:

1. God commands it. Deuteronomy 6:7 says, "You shall teach them diligently to your sons and shall talk of them when you sit in your house and when you walk by the way and when you lie down and when you rise up." And Ephesians 6:4 says, "Fathers, do not provoke your children to anger, but bring them up in the discipline and instruction of the Lord."
2. We can teach our children what we know God wants. Proverbs 1:7 says, "The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge; Fools despise wisdom and instruction." We are to teach our children to "love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might." (Deut. 6:5)
3. The government schools won't be usurping our role as parents. The above verses are addressed to parents, more specifically, fathers. We cannot pass the responsibility on to someone else, be it a godly person or the ungodly state. We are responsible for whatever they are taught.

What is homeschooling?
It is educating our children. What does 'educate' mean? Educate means, according to the New Merriam-Webster dictionary, to develop mentally and morally. The Greeks had another word for educate, paideia. The word paideia is found in Ephesians 6:4, as "nurture" or "instruction". Paideia was used by the ancient Greeks to define the whole of education, the totality of life. Walking, talking, baking bread, reading, listening to music, writing, everything is education. You learn something from everything. We teach our children the fear of the Lord through everything that we do.

Our goal in homeschooling (education) is to bring our children up in the fear of the Lord. There are 3 common objections to this goal. The first is, government schools are capable, and/or I can counteract their influence. Second, I'm not equipped to teach my children. The third objection, my goal is to bring up a doctor, or a lawyer. I seek to address these objections in this thread. I ask that any who believe that they are correct to feel free to object some more. I am quite certain that truth will prevail on this issue. If I am incorrect in any area, I welcome rebuke and exhortation based on Scripture. If you cannot hold it up to Scripture, I'm afraid that I cannot accept your viewpoint as correct.

The first objection: Government ("public") Schools are Capable
Otherwise known as the "I can counteract their influence" argument, this is used quite frequently, and also with little thought. Let's set this up. Why do we have government schools? To educate children. Given: education includes everything about life. Given: government schools seek to educate. Therefore, government schools attempt to teach our children about everything. Given: the state is not Christ-centered. Therefore, the state will teach our children humanism (the religion of America's schools). How are they capable of bringing our children up in the "nurture and admonition of the Lord" if they teach humanism? They are not able. The state is humanist and liberal- the proof of this is in our very own children that walk out of the school's doors to a life that is hopeless and ambition-driven. Kill the babies and the old people, they just get in our way. That is the result of a humanist indoctrination station teaching our kids that they evolved from monkeys and that human life isn't valuable. But I digress. This is an entire other paper. The point is this: government schools teach humanism, not Christ. If they teach this to our children for 7 hours a day, 5 days a week, and we attempt to counteract this with Sunday school, does anyone really believe it will work? Obviously, the Holy Spirit cannot be quenched by government schools, but why would you even want to send them there? We don't want to get as close to the line of impurity as possible! It is the equivalent of saying,"Hey, kids! It's time to go play with Eminem and Brittany now! And guess what? Later tonight, we'll read this great story about Jonah!" And when they're teens, the kids'll say,"No way, old man. I'm out. I got stuff to do." Where will they be? Not anywhere safe, I can assure you of that. Some of you, I'm sure, will attempt to raise the objection that schools are a mission field. Go ahead. I don't have room to address that here. We'll have to speak to that later. And don't even try that, "you're sheltering them" stuff. All I have to say to that is, what will you accuse me of next? Feeding and clothing them?

The Second Objection: I'm Not Equipped.
This objection is quickly answered. God would not abandon us to do something that is not in our power to do. It is not a hard thing to teach a child to read. If you know how to read, you can teach your child how to read. Why do we teach our children to read? So that they can read the Bible. If reading the Bible is your ultimate goal, you are already more equipped than the government schools, since they do not seem to be able to teach reading. Reading the Bible is a necessity (foundational. Not to say that math isn't godly. Math is a side issue comparatively). Why do we teach our children to behave in a manner worthy of the gospel? So that they can be an example to others. Philippians 2:15 says, "Do all things without grumbling or disputing, so that you will prove yourselves to be blameless and innocent, children of God above reproach in the midst of a crooked and perverse generation among whom you appear as lights in the world." Our behavior teaches our children how to behave. Behavior is a little bit harder to teach, but you have the best teacher yourself-God. This objection really goes along with the next one, which is….

The Third Objection: I'm Raising Up a Lawyer
Some take issue with this statement, saying that they want their children to be church members. You know, the ones that tithe, sing in the choir, and teach Sunday school. Isn't that the goal? May it never be! Granted, these things can be good. But the goal of home education is to bring up our children in the nurture and admonition of the Lord. That doesn’t mean smart kids, even though they will be (the fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge, Proverbs 1:7). That means children who obey the law of the Lord and love Him with all their hearts, minds, souls, and strength. And that takes knowing His law, which in turn takes being able to read it.

Three things God does not say:
- "Lookee, Joe. Here's this kid. You take care of 'em. I want them to be a lawyer and go to a Baptist church."
- "I'm gonna loan you this kid for a while. Homeschool them so they'll be smarter than anyone else."
- "Put this kid in public school so that he can 'take the school for Christ'. Don't worry, it's where I want him. You couldn't do it anyway."

God has explicitly commanded parents (fathers, actually, but that's another paper too) to teach their children at home. Do not send them off on the prison bus to the church of the state!


Things related that I'd be happy to refute and/or debate:
Socialization
Curriculum (not necessarily bad)
Private schools
"Christian" schools
Feminism
Federal headship (yay!)
Culture
Why the government is teaching illegally

[Bartholomew]

Welcome to TWEB! I hope more enthusiastic (sic) posters join this thread.

For starters, I attended a Christian private school for seven years and I do not see how the verses you listed were violated in the process. Even though I spent a good deal of time at school, I also spent a decent amount of time with my parents most nights of the week at dinner and on the weekends as well. I have learned from them what I could about God, although most of my studies and spiritual life have come from Church and other Christians my age.

I don't see why it would be necessary to homeschool children, since I don't read that in any of the verses you mentioned. Must a child stay at home in order for them to receive the education that you promote (which I am not denying)?

~Matt

[Patroclus]

"You shall teach them diligently to your sons and shall talk of them when you sit in your house and when you walk by the way and when you lie down and when you rise up." And Ephesians 6:4 says, "Fathers, do not provoke your children to anger, but bring them up in the discipline and instruction of the Lord."

How does this negate the influence of outside forces? Do you know anything about the society at the time this was written? They would learn as a community. Paul was a man educated at the most important pharisaical school in Tarsus. These verse are about responsible parenting, not educational philosophy.

according to the New Merriam-Webster dictionary

Homeschoolers really like to use Websters, probably because Webster was a Christian, and his definitions have a Christian bent. However, that bias is what makes Websters an unreliable source. Always check definitions from Webster against the OED.

Why do we have government schools? To educate children. Given: education includes everything about life.

Always simultaneously?

Given: government schools seek to educate. Therefore, government schools attempt to teach our children about everything.

No, they seek to teach academics (a good school anyway). With this logic, everytime you teach your kid how to bake a cake, you are teaching them a little something about nuclear physics.

Given: the state is not Christ-centered. Therefore, the state will teach our children humanism (the religion of America's schools).

Humanism is not a religion. It invloves no ritual, no necessary morality, no organization and no creed.

This objection is quickly answered. God would not abandon us to do something that is not in our power to do. It is not a hard thing to teach a child to read. If you know how to read, you can teach your child how to read. Why do we teach our children to read? So that they can read the Bible.

What if you can't read? Should your children be just as illiterate as you? This is a pretty terrible way to manage a child's education. If you can't read, then you can't teach your child everything about life. If you do not know nuclear physics, you can't teach your children everything about life. That is the tricky thing with the words "totality" and "everything." If you are going to use it like you did earler

Paideia was used by the ancient Greeks to define the whole of education, the totality of life. Walking, talking, baking bread, reading, listening to music, writing, everything is education. You learn something from everything.

Some take issue with this statement, saying that they want their children to be church members. You know, the ones that tithe, sing in the choir, and teach Sunday school. Isn't that the goal? May it never be! Granted, these things can be good. But the goal of home education is to bring up our children in the nurture and admonition of the Lord. That doesn’t mean smart kids, even though they will be (the fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge, Proverbs 1:7). That means children who obey the law of the Lord and love Him with all their hearts, minds, souls, and strength. And that takes knowing His law, which in turn takes being able to read it.

Okay, first of all, wehn you say, "May it never be, "it sounds like you are trying to sound like Paul in his letter to the Romans.

So, you do not think that children should be smart if the parents aren't smart? Are you afraid that your children will pass you intelectually? Basically, it sounds to me anyway, you would prefer a race of people who spiraled into further and further stupidity. What do you think of college?

I don't mean any disrespect, but it is this kind of rhetoric that gives homeschoolers a bad name. I was homeschooled for eleven years, and I just graduated (yesterday, in fact) with honors, with a B.A. in English Literature. I doubt that it is against God's plan that I be educated. I know where I benefitted from homeschooling, and where it hindered me.

I know some terrible parents that should NEVER homeschool. What do you say about abusive parents?

[Eglerio_i_hir]

I will address both posts (InquisitorKind and Patroclus) in this post.

Matt:
Thanks for the warm welcome! I hope I can answer your questions sufficiently.

- How do Christian private schools violate these verses?
The model of a Christian private school is not necessarily unbiblical--but only if the parents are the primary educators. The issue is how much time is spent being taught by someone other than the parents, and whether or not the parents are wrongly delegating their authority. My personal issue with Christian schools is that most are "Christian". They are schools that are very nominal and doctrinally unsound. And the parents aren't in charge of their children's education! They give them over to Evanjellyfish "Christians" (thanks to www.highlandsstudycenter.org for this term!).
If there was a school (I know of a few) that met one or two times a week to teach higher math or science that might be acceptable. But, I'm on dangerous ground with that, considering the fact that there is no such example anywhere in the Bible.
The optimal model for education is having a community of believers close by that would be happy to teach your child (one-on-one) the things in which they show an interest.

- Why is it necessary to homeschool children?
You said, "Must a child stay at home in order for them to receive the education that you promote (which I am not denying)?"
Yes. Check out my first post.

Does that help any?

Patroclus:
Interesting logic. I have some interesting logic of my own. I realized that my argument concerning government schools and education was not argued clearly enough. I will fix it.

- "How does this negate the influence of outside forces?"
You cannot totally negate the influence of outside forces, ever. However, if your children are homeschooled according to Biblical standards, and you do not watch the idiot box, you will greatly reduce that influence.
- Deuteronomy 6 and Ephesians 6 are speaking about responsible parenting and not educational philosophy.
First, I am aware of the believing community in Acts. Also, your point concerning Paul is not valid, seeing as he was brought up to be a non-believer.
My point was and is that "responsible parenting" and "educational philosophy" go hand in hand. Part of being a responsible (Biblical!!) parent is educating your children according to Scripture. And Scripture says, teach your kids the fear of the Lord!
- Webster's Dictionary is biased
I've actually never heard this, and I didn't know until 1 week ago that he was a Christian. The only reason I use that dictionary is because it's on my desk. But, since he's "biased", here's a definition of "educate" from the American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language: "To stimulate or develop the mental or moral growth of." The goal of "education" is to make the children cultured. Culture is defined as, "Totality of socially transmitted behavior patterns, arts, beliefs, institutions, and all other products of human work and thought." (also from the AHD). I looked online at about 10 different dictionaries (not Webster's), and the majority included morals or culture in the definition. Those that did not merely said, "to teach or train", or something like it. The question is, to teach them what? You cannot separate academics from culture or morals (more on this later).
- "Why do we have government schools? To educate children. Given: education includes everything about life." Always simultaneously?
I didn't quite understand the question. But, here's the more clear logical argument concerning government schools and education:
If: everything that is learned is learned through education,
If: everything is under the sovereignty of God for the purpose of His glory,
If: We see that everything is under the sovereignty of God for the purpose of His glory by learning,
Then: education must be God-centered.
Anyone who does not realize this cannot educate correctly. They are lacking.
- Humanism isn't a religion.
I beg to differ. From the Cambridge Advanced Learner's Dictionary: "a belief system based on the principle that people's spiritual and emotional needs can be fulfilled without following a god or religion"
You cannot separate academics from morals. It is impossible. See logic above.
The attempt to do so is humanism, and it is a religion.
- What if you can't read?
This argument is based upon the assumption that law should be made from the exceptions. You don't go to the exception to determine the rule.
- "wehn[sic] you say, "May it never be, "it sounds like you are trying to sound like Paul in his letter to the Romans."
I wasn't trying to sound like Paul, I think it's funny and very good when Paul says that, and what's wrong with trying to sound like Paul anyway?
- "So, you do not think that children should be smart if the parents aren't smart? Are you afraid that your children will pass you intelectually[sic]?"
That is not what I said, neither is it what I believe. I hope with everything that my children will be more sanctified than I, and also that they will be more intelligent. BUT, the foundation and indeed, ultimate goal of education is to bring children up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord! To teach them the mind of Christ comes first, everything else is but a side note. If I die after I teach my children the mind of Christ, then I will have accomplished my goal. If they have that, they will have a desire to learn everything they can about the Lord.
- What do you think about college?
I'm hesitant to say, only because my radical views would probably cause a side debate to confuse the issue of homeschooling that we are here attempting to discuss. Therefore, I will give my opinion, you can see if it's Biblical, and then if you want to discuss it more, you may certainly start a new thread. I do not feel that it would be best to discuss it further here.
I believe that, Biblically (not using exception to make law):
1. "Higher education" for the sake of higher education is unbiblical, whether it be man or woman.
2. Higher education for the sake of glorifying God is Biblical.
3. College is used by men as a means for gaining a tentmaking skill.
4. Girls do not have a need for college, and it only serves to impede their pursuit of purity in Christ. If a woman's role is in the home (it is--see Paul's letters), and college helps her in that role, then college is acceptable.
"For me, the honor of taking dominion and fighting this spiritual battle means having lots of beautiful babies, rocking them to sleep, changing their diapers, feeding them three well-balanced meals a day, teaching them God’s law through Bible reading, catechisms, hymn singing and church involvement, reading them lots of stories, kissing their owies, disciplining them when they disobey, teaching them to read good books, instilling an awe in them for God’s creation, teaching both my daughters and sons to cook, reminding them constantly to prefer one another above themselves, talking with them all day long about every imaginable subject, modeling obedience and love before them in my marriage to my wonderful husband and daily sacrificing my desires while serving my family. Did college teach me how to do any of these things? Nope." --Carmon Friedrich, mother of 10

- What about abusive parents?
Again, using the exception to dictate the rule is not acceptable practice. Obviously, none of this applies to non-Christians. No true Christian parent would abuse his or her child.

I trust that this answers your questions.

P.S. The problem I have with these posts is that neither one of you used Scripture to back your arguments. Could we remedy that, please? I would appreciate it.

[Bartholomew]

Yesterday @ 11:33 PM post located here
Eglerio_i_hir:

Yes. Check out my first post.

Okay, will do. I'll check again before responding.

P.S. The problem I have with these posts is that neither one of you used Scripture to back your arguments. Could we remedy that, please? I would appreciate it.

I didn't feel that what you said was supported enough by Scripture. We can remedy that (well, I guess I could remedy that...I can't speak for anyone else). If you'd like me to discuss why I don't think those verses support your argument, let me know.

~Matt

[Socrates]

Eglerio_i_hir is correct to advocate home education, and for the right reason. "The fear of the Lord" is the beginning of true wisdom and knowledge (Proverbs 1:7, 9:10). Therefore a godless State School system is flawed right at the outset by denying this implicitly even if if doesn't say so explicitly.

Actually, there is quite a good discussion on homeschooling in the thread » Main Campus » Political Science Dept. » Homeschoolers not impressed with new tv sitcom.

[Eglerio_i_hir]

Matt:
I would like to hear why you think those verses do not apply. Thanks.

Socrates:
Thank you for the support, and the link.

[Patroclus]

your point concerning Paul is not valid, seeing as he was brought up to be a non-believer.

It is absolutely valid if you are citing Old Testament Scripture. Paul was taught to Love God and live by the Torah, just like his predecessors in Biblical times.

- "Why do we have government schools? To educate children. Given: education includes everything about life." Always simultaneously?
I didn't quite understand the question.

In other words, what you were saying is that all of education occurs simultaneously (at the same time). I am asking if this is necessarily true. Must there be a moral lesson involved in car repair?

If: everything that is learned is learned through education,
If: everything is under the sovereignty of God for the purpose of His glory,
If: We see that everything is under the sovereignty of God for the purpose of His glory by learning,
Then: education must be God-centered.

Improper syllogism--too many premeses.

If: everything that is learned is learned through education,

One does not learn through education. To learn is to be educated. To be educated is to learn. These are parallel terms unless you are talking about a formal or structured education. This is not a given until your terms are defined and agreed upon. I do not agree that all education must occur simultaneously.

I'll conceed to your second premise as a given.

If: We see that everything is under the sovereignty of God for the purpose of His glory by learning,

Ths is not very well worded. I am not sure what you are saying. The premise is not given.

I am glad to see that you are using the American Heritage Dictionary.

- Humanism isn't a religion.
I beg to differ. From the Cambridge Advanced Learner's Dictionary: "a belief system based on the principle that people's spiritual and emotional needs can be fulfilled without following a god or religion"

Look at the the definition closely--"without following a....religion." Like I said, there is no ritual, creed or leadership, only belief. Belief is not religion. You believe that washing machines exist. But that is hardly a religion of washing machines.

You cannot separate academics from morals. It is impossible. See logic above.
The attempt to do so is humanism, and it is a religion.

The logic is currently invalid, and the statement about humanism is not proven. Therefore, I do not believe it is impossible to separate academics from morals.

1. "Higher education" for the sake of higher education is unbiblical, whether it be man or woman.

If you mean that it is unbiblical according to your previous logic, I think you need better support.

3. College is used by men as a means for gaining a tentmaking skill.

Fallacious--hasty generalization

it only serves to impede their pursuit of purity in Christ.

Also a hasty generalization

If a woman's role is in the home (it is--see Paul's letters),

The very fact that this issue is continually debated means that this is a personal opinion, whether right or wrong. I happen to find fifty percent of the following quote that you gave very distrubing. But, I do not want to get too side-tracked on this issue.

Again, using the exception to dictate the rule is not acceptable practice.

I know you made a similar point earlier. But I want to say that it is a good one. What I wanted to know is what should be done about a child in an abusive family? What if the child is a Christian? I am not trying to change the rule. What I am saying is that I think your "rule" is not universal, and therefore no rule at all. You are not saying, "In general, parents should homeschool their children." You are making an absolute statment, given that we are discussing Christian parents.

P.S. The problem I have with these posts is that neither one of you used Scripture to back your arguments. Could we remedy that, please? I would appreciate it.

So far, I have not made a positive argument. Therefore, using scripture would be impossible at best, and pointless at worst. All I have done is ask questions and debunk your logic and eisogetical interpretation of the scriptures.

Again, I am not opposed to homeschooling. However, I am opposed to this kind of marketing for homeschooling.

[Socrates]

Eglerio_i_hir

If: everything that is learned is learned through education,
If: everything is under the sovereignty of God for the purpose of His glory,
If: We see that everything is under the sovereignty of God for the purpose of His glory by learning,
Then: education must be God-centered.

Patroclus:

• Improper syllogism--too many premeses.

Oh please. Who said this was a syllogism? A valid argument can have as many premises as it needs. So please try to deal with the logical validity or the truth of the premises, rather than counting them.

In any case, I have argued for the conclusion from Scripture.

[Vorkosigan]

Did college teach me how to do any of these things? Nope."

Was it supposed to? That's like criticizing my dog because it can't cook dinner or grade my students' homework.

Vorkosigan

[Eglerio_i_hir]

Patroclus:

Refute my arguments with Scripture, if you can. If you cannot, I have no need for your logic. We have all strayed too far from determining fact by Scripture. Human logic does not dictate truth--Scripture does. After we all agree that Scripture tells us to homeschool, then we can decide the pragmatics of that using Scripture and some logic. Until, then, no more.

[Patroclus]

Oh please. Who said this was a syllogism? A valid argument can have as many premises as it needs. So please try to deal with the logical validity or the truth of the premises, rather than counting them.

My mistake, Socrates. In the context, I thought that is what she was trying to do.

Eglerio_i_hir:Refute my arguments with Scripture, if you can. If you cannot, I have no need for your logic. We have all strayed too far from determining fact by Scripture. Human logic does not dictate truth--Scripture does. After we all agree that Scripture tells us to homeschool, then we can decide the pragmatics of that using Scripture and some logic. Until, then, no more.

You are pretensious, aren't you?

I think, then, we need to clear something up. Do you, or do you not, believe that all action requires a prior mandate from scripture?

Also, you have yet you have yet to prove how your scripture mandates homeschooling. You merely quoted them with no explanation whatsoever, and said that they mandate homeschooling.

I'll start using scripture when you start.

[John Reece]

Eglerio_i_hir,

Welcome to TWeb!

Blessings upon you, your family, and the school in your home.

Our daughters went to public school. While our youngest was in high school, we learned what she was being taught, saw the fruits of it in her peers, and as a result all our 7 grandchildren are being home-schooled.

The fruit of the latter is precious to behold.

[Patroclus]

Socrates:
Oh, please make your attributions clearer.

Sort of like that? I tend to forget.

[Eglerio_i_hir]

John Reece:

Thank you for the welcome and the prayed blessings- although the last upon the school in my home should be in future tense.
I went to government school as well, and am still reeling from the effects on my mind and conscience. It is a wonderful thing to see those who have never set foot in the door of such a school.