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Thread: Paul: The Worship of the Lord Jesus

  1. #11
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by foudroyant View Post
    This was already addressed in Post #5.
    Post #5 says nothing but it does link to another thread which I admit I was truant in not reading.
    http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/sh...Jesus-answered

    I'm not aware of any orthodox church that directs their prays directly at Jesus. Of course the Sabellianisers (oneness churches) do! I'm RCC and I was always taught to direct my prays to the Father, in the name of Jesus Christ...For pray is a thanksgiving, and it was the Father who sent his only begotten Son to be saviour of the world. Have a think on John 12:44 "Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on him that sent me.

    Also I'm awaiting your response to the questions I proffered in post #6...I'll repeat them continuously until you answer them...

    Questions arise: Do you ascribe to the Nicene Creed or reject it? Do you believe that before his incarnation the Son was begotten by his Father, not made, God from God? Do you believe that the Son is a distinct entity/individual from his Father? Do you believe the scripture's account that the Son was incarnated not of his own volition but was sent by his Father? Do you believe that in the end of times the Son will share his Father's throne, at the will of the Father? Do you believe, as A.Paul certainly did, that God (the Father) raised Jesus from the dead?
    Last edited by apostoli; 08-02-2014 at 10:17 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by apostoli View Post
    I'm not aware of any orthodox church that directs their prays directly at Jesus.
    So what? The Bible teaches that He was and is to be prayed to.

    You can keep asking your other questions all you want but since you can't even get prayers to the Lord Jesus correct (what this thread has to do with) then nothing else will make sense.
    Last edited by foudroyant; 08-02-2014 at 11:39 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tabibito View Post
    Act 7:59 And they stoned Stephen as he was calling on God and saying, “Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.”
    (dreadful rendering, for all that it is correct: any word that identifies Christ as being called out to, rather than "God" would be more appropriate)
    Yup - Stephen calls out to Jesus. Where does it say he was praying or worshiping?
    By calling out to Him it is praying to Him.
    See the OP, Part "D".
    http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/sh...the-Lord-Jesus

  4. #14
    tWebber tabibito's Avatar
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    I'm satisfied that if the Biblical author had wanted to say "prayed", he would have used the appropriate word. I don't hold with any story that "the author said X but he really meant Y"
    και εκζητησατε με και ευρησετε με οτι ζητησετε με εν ολη καρδία υμων

  5. #15
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by foudroyant View Post
    So what? The Bible teaches that He was and is to be prayed to.

    You can keep asking your other questions all you want but since you can't even get prayers to the Lord Jesus correct (what this thread has to do with) then nothing else will make sense.
    You really do need to understand the difference between supplication and prayer...Jesus tells us he taught and does what his Father wants...

    Given you refuse to attest to the simplest of Christian belief, I'll assume you aren't a Christian. I'll also assume you belong to some obscure American cult that refuses to accept Christian scripture...

    But I'll give you another chance...

    Questions arise: Do you ascribe to the Nicene Creed or reject it? Do you believe that before his incarnation the Son was begotten by his Father, not made, God from God? Do you believe that the Son is a distinct entity/individual from his Father? Do you believe the scripture's account that the Son was incarnated not of his own volition but was sent by his Father? Do you believe that in the end of times the Son will share his Father's throne, at the will of the Father? Do you believe, as A.Paul certainly did, that God (the Father) raised Jesus from the dead?

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    Quote Originally Posted by tabibito View Post
    I'm satisfied that if the Biblical author had wanted to say "prayed", he would have used the appropriate word. I don't hold with any story that "the author said X but he really meant Y"
    There are different ways to express a truth claim.

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    Quote Originally Posted by apostoli View Post
    You really do need to understand the difference between supplication and prayer...Jesus tells us he taught and does what his Father wants...
    And His Father wants us to pray to the Lord Jesus.

    One more chance? I don't need any chances from you, idiot. You can't even figure out that the Lord Jesus is prayed to.

    Take your stupidity elsewhere.
    Last edited by foudroyant; 08-02-2014 at 09:31 PM.

  8. #18
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by foudroyant View Post
    And His Father wants us to pray to the Lord Jesus.

    One more chance? I don't need any chances from you, idiot. You can't even figure out that the Lord Jesus is prayed to.

    Take your stupidity elsewhere.
    Interesting! You attack the JWs but apparently deny the very basics of mainstream Christian teaching!!!!

    I'll give you another chance...

    Questions arise: Do you ascribe to the Nicene Creed or reject it? Do you believe that before his incarnation the Son was begotten by his Father, not made, God from God? Do you believe that the Son is a distinct entity/individual from his Father? Do you believe the scripture's account that the Son was incarnated not of his own volition but was sent by his Father? Do you believe that in the end of times the Son will share his Father's throne, at the will of the Father? Do you believe, as A.Paul certainly did, that God (the Father) raised Jesus from the dead? Do you believe, as the apostles John & Paul certainly did, that all Jesus did was for the glorification of his Father (cp. Jn 17, Phil 2)

    Failure to answer such basic questions will reveal you to be the fraud you actualise...

    Jesus well describes you and like at John 8:44 "Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do... "

    Of course Christians supplicate to Jesus, but we do so for the intervention of his Father. As Jesus puts it at John 14:13: "And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son."

    Note John 3:34-35 "For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him. The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand..."
    Last edited by apostoli; 08-03-2014 at 02:51 AM.

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    Yeah Christians are to pray to the Lord Jesus -> the point of this thread.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by foudroyant View Post
    Yeah Christians are to pray to the Lord Jesus -> the point of this thread.
    As is typical of you, you can't differentiate between prayer and supplication...or for that matter Jesus' & the apostles' teaching concerning the direction or meaning for our prayer...

    Seems you are intent on ignoring Christian teaching for around the last 20 centuries...so JWs and everyone else may as well ignore your cult's perspective and your evident ignorance (socially, scripturally and intellectually)...

    If you see yourself as a Christian in some form (no matter how obviously abnormal), you should have no trouble in answering the following questions in the affirmative....failure to do so, simply reveals you to be a fraud (something you currently evidence)...but in Christian kindness I'll give you another chance...

    Questions arise: Do you ascribe to the Nicene Creed or reject it? Do you believe that before his incarnation the Son was begotten by his Father, not made, God from God? Do you believe that the Son is a distinct entity/individual from his Father? Do you believe the scripture's account that the Son was incarnated not of his own volition but was sent by his Father? Do you believe that in the end of times the Son will share his Father's throne, at the will of the Father? Do you believe, as A.Paul certainly did, that God (the Father) raised Jesus from the dead? Do you believe, as the apostles John & Paul certainly did, that all Jesus did was for the glorification of his Father (cp. Jn 17, Phil 2)
    Last edited by apostoli; 08-03-2014 at 03:03 AM.

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