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Thread: The Worship opf Jesus in the Book of Revelation

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    The Worship of Jesus in the Book of Revelation

    A. The Jehovah's Witnesses believe the Lord Jesus is not God and so therefore should never be worshiped.
    1. Reverent adoration should be expressed only to God. To render worship to anyone or anything else would be a form of idolatry...True Christians do well to direct their worship only to Jehovah God, the Almighty (Awake! April 8, 2000, page 26+27). Since "every prayer is a form of worship" (The Watchtower, December 15, 1994, page 23) this would mean that praying to the Lord Jesus is not allowed.

    B. Revelation 1:5-6
    and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn of the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth. To Him who loves us and released us from our sins by His blood-
    and He has made us to be a kingdom, priests to His God and Father-to Him be the glory and the dominion forever and ever. Amen.
    1. See "Doxologies to the Lord Jesus Christ": http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/sh...d-Jesus-Christ

    C. Revelation 2:23 and Revelation 5:6
    And I will kill her children with pestilence, and all the churches will know that I am He who searches the minds and hearts; and I will give to each one of you according to your deeds (Revelation 2:23, NASB).
    And I saw between the throne (with the four living creatures) and the elders a Lamb standing, as if slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God, sent out into all the earth (Revelation 5:6, NASB).
    1. Although these passages do not demonstrate that the Lord Jesus is being worshiped they do lay the foundation as to why He is worshiped in that He is both omnipotent and omniscient.
    See Revelation 2:23 in Jesus as the heart-knower of all (καρδιογνώστης = omniscience)‏: http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/sh...ce%29%E2%80%8F
    See Revelation 5:6 in "The omnipotence and omniscience of Jesus": http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/sh...ience-of-Jesus

    D. Revelation 5:11-14
    Then I looked, and I heard the voice of many angels around the throne and the living creatures and the elders; and the number of them was myriads of myriads, and thousands of thousands, saying with a loud voice, "Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power and riches and wisdom and might and honor and glory and blessing." And every created thing which is in heaven and on the earth and under the earth and on the sea, and all things in them, I heard saying, "To Him who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb, be blessing and honor and glory and dominion forever and ever." And the four living creatures kept saying, "Amen." And the elders fell down and worshiped (Revelation 5:11-14, NASB).
    1. Mounce: Those who worship God and the Lamb ascribe power to them (Rev. 4:11; 5:12; 7:12; 19:1) (Mounce's Complete Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words, Power, page 526).
    2. Mounce: Blessing God involves both words and thoughts that magnify, honor, and praise God's being, nature, and attributes (Rev. 5:12-13; 7:12). Such praises are acts of worship (Mounce's Complete Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words, Blessing, page 71).
    3. NIDNTT: arnion occurs 4 times in Rev. 5 (vv. 6, 8, 12 f.), where Christ is seen in this two-fold aspect. On the one hand, he is the Lord, the one who opens the seals and who is to be worshipped. On the other hand, he is esphagmenon arnion ("a lamb that was slain") having redeemed men of all races to God by his blood, and made them kings and priests (Rev. 5:9, 10) (2:411, Lamb, J. Gess).
    4. TDNT: In Rev. 5:3 the seer, taught by the revelation of Jesus Christ, realises that there is none in heaven or on earth who has the power or worth to open the sealed book, and in 5:13 he hears all creation in heaven and on earth, also under the earth and on the sea, praising the Lamb who alone is worthy; the Lamb is not one of the all things in heaven and on earth (5:518, heaven, Traub).
    5. TDNT: Doxologies which acknowledge and magnify God's eternal being and Godhead ascribe ischus to God and His Christ, Rev. 5:12; 7:12 (3:399, might, Grundmann).
    6. TDNT: In 5:12f. the angelic choirs extol the omnipotence of the Lamb in a seven-membered doxology (8:178, Honor, J. Schneider).
    7. NIDNTT: He who sits upon the throne is worthy to receive glory, honour and power, for he has created all things and they owe their existence to his will (4:11). This worship of every creature (ktisma) belongs (5:13) not only to him, but also the Lamb (a metaphor for the crucified and exalted One) (1:386, Creation, H.H. Esser).
    8. Murray Harris: Object of worship (Matt. 14:33; 28:9, 17; John 5:23; 20:28; Phil. 2:10-11; Heb. 1:6; Rev. 5:8-12) (Jesus as God, An Outline to the New Testament Testimony to the Deity of Christ, page 316).
    9. NIDNTT: In Revelation sophia is praised in two hymnic texts as an attribute of God (Rev. 7:12; cf. also Rom. 16:27); it is also to be attributed to the slain Lamb at his exaltation (Rev. 5:12). The exalted Christ has the same power and wisdom as God (3:1032, Wisdom, J. Goetzmann).
    10. Thayer: supreme intelligence, such as belongs to God: Rev. 7:12, also to Christ, exalted to God's right hand, Rev. 5:12 (Thayer's Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament, sophia, page 582).
    11. Mounce: In a remarkable attestation to the deity of Jesus Christ, the apostle John records two doxologies in which what is ascribed to God (the Father) is also ascribed to the Lamb, who is Jesus the Son (Rev. 5:12, "Worthy is the Lamb to receive...strength"; 7:12, "Praise and ...strength be to our God forever") (Mounce's Complete Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words, Strength, page 688).
    12. Vine: used in ascriptions of worship to God, 1 Timothy 1:17; 6:16; Revelation 4:9, 11; 5:13; 7:12; to Christ, Revelation 5:12, 13 (Vine's Expository Dictionary of NT Words, Honor)
    http://www.studylight.org/dic/ved/view.cgi?n=1401
    13. Samuel Slocock: Do we read that in this universal bust of adoration, supreme blessing, supreme honor, supreme glory, and power, are ascribed to the Father, and that subordinate blessing, honour, and glory are presented to the Lamb. No: the same unqualified terms are used, are used in describing the homage paid to the Eternal, and that presented to the Lamb (A Vindication of the Supreme Divinity of Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, So Far as That Doctrine Is Impugned, in "a Critical Examination of the Remarkable Prediction Contained in Isaiah 9:6, a Sermon by J. Kitcat", page 162).

    E. Revelation 7:10 and 12:10
    and they cry out with a loud voice, saying, "Salvation to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb" (Revelation 7:10, NASB).
    Then I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying, "Now the salvation, and the power, and the kingdom of our God and the authority of His Christ have come, for the accuser of our brethren has been thrown down, he who accuses them before our God day and night (Revelation 12:10, NASB).
    1. Mounce: Those who worship God and the Lamb ascribe power to them (Rev. 4:11; 5:12; 7:12; 19:1) (Mounce's Complete Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words, Power, page 526).
    2. Mounce: Citing Revelation 12:10 it reads: Those who worship God and his Son ascribe authority to him (Mounce's Complete Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words, Authority, page 47).
    3. Mounce: Blessing God involves both words and thoughts that magnify, honor, and praise God's being, nature and attributes (Rev. 5:12-13; 7:12). Such praises are acts of worship (Mounce's Complete Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words, Blessing, page 71).
    4. NIDNTT: The Lamb is worshipped at the same time as God (7:10) (2:412, Lamb, J. Gess).
    5. NIDNTT: In Rev. only the noun is found, in all 3 cases in liturgical passages of worship. In Rev. 7:10 the great multitude attributes salvation to God and the Lamb; this is heard again in Rev. 12:10 after the fall of the dragon, and in Rev.19:1 after the fall of Babylon. The songs of triumph and victory proclaim that now, after the conquest of all enemies of God, salvation, glory and power belong to God alone (3:216, Redemption, J. Schneider).

    F. Revelation 22:3
    There will no longer be any curse; and the throne of God and of the Lamb will be in it, and His bond-servants will serve Him (Revelation 22:3, NASB).
    1. See "The Lord Jesus receives latreuo (Revelation 22:3)": http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/sh...lation-22-3%29

    G. Revelation 22:20
    He who testifies to these things says, "Yes, I am coming quickly." Amen. Come, Lord Jesus (Revelation 22:20, NASB).
    a. NIDNTT: Such an apokalypsis is also the great theme of Rev (1:1), which ends its vision of the future with a prayer "Amen, Come, Lord Jesus" (22:20) (3:316, Revelation, W. Mundle).
    b. TDNT: Under "Christian prayers": Rev. 22:20 shows that it is the answer of the ekklesia to the divine Yes (1:337, amen, Schlier).
    c. TDNT: The prayer for the coming of Christ is strengthened by the words: amen, erxou kurie Iesou (22:20) (2:674, erxomai, Schneider).
    d. Mounce: Citing Revelation 22:20: That should still be our prayer; we should always be living in the expectation of the return of our Lord, Jesus Christ (Mounce's Complete Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words, Maranatha, pages 440-441).

    H. The Jehovah's Witnesses belief that the Lord Jesus is not to be worshiped runs contrary to what several passages in the Book of Revelation affirm.
    Last edited by foudroyant; 06-25-2014 at 04:47 PM.

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    Has the latreuo*described in Revelation 22:3 occurred yet? or is the latreuo*a future event that will take place?

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    The premise of this post is misleading. When I was a JW member in the 90s, the doctrine was to worship Jehovah through his son Jesus. Though it is correct that they believe the two to be separate, it is not correct that they believe in withholding worship from Jesus, since God delegates authority to him. Since points A & H are incorrect, it requires a reworking of your argument substantially.

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    how do you worship someone THROUGH someone else? That is just gobbledygook doublespeak the JW's come up with to try to explain why Jesus is worshiped. And he is worshiped directly in the bible exactly like the Father. You can't worship someone by worshiping someone else. If you could, why would it be wrong to worship God through angels? The bible condemns angel worship. Heck in Revelation, and angel tells John not to bow before him and if anyone was worshiping God it was Paul. So the JW excuse of "woshiping the Father through the Son" is nonsense.

  5. Amen Cerebrum123 amen'd this post.
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    Well, my point is that if you are trying to convince a JW of your Trinitarian viewpoint, and the first thing they see is point "A", then immediately they would look at it and say to themselves "I don't believe that!", and the rest of the post is summarily dismissed, subconsciously, if not consciously. Colossians 1:15,16 explains the special authority given to Christ that is not bestowed upon the angels.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Super Cow View Post
    Well, my point is that if you are trying to convince a JW of your Trinitarian viewpoint, and the first thing they see is point "A", then immediately they would look at it and say to themselves "I don't believe that!", and the rest of the post is summarily dismissed, subconsciously, if not consciously. Colossians 1:15,16 explains the special authority given to Christ that is not bestowed upon the angels.
    yeah I can agree with that. Foudroyant wasnt the brightest of bulbs and tended to show someone a forest when he should have just shown them a tree. his argument above is overly complicated. he could have just shown in the bible where Jesus was genuinely worshiped and prayed to, then wait for the JW response that you gave, then proceed to show how they were wrong. Show them where Jesus is indeed God and deserves worship.

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