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Matthew 12:40 an idiom?

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  • Are there any 6th day of the week crucifxion believing folks visiting this site who think that Matthew 12:40 is using common idiomatic/figure of speech/colloquial language - language where a daytime or a night time was said to be involved with an event when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could have occurred?

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    • Originally posted by rstrats View Post
      Are there any 6th day of the week crucifxion believing folks visiting this site who think that Matthew 12:40 is using common idiomatic/figure of speech/colloquial language - language where a daytime or a night time was said to be involved with an event when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could have occurred?
      Why do you care? You've got the only answer that there is.

      Comment


      • Moderated By: sparko

        rstrats, you have a private message from the staff that you need to take care of ASAP.

        ***If you wish to take issue with this notice DO NOT do so in this thread.***
        Contact the forum moderator or an administrator in Private Message or email instead. If you feel you must publicly complain or whine, please take it to the Padded Room unless told otherwise.


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        • thread closed

          Comment


          • thread reopened for now.

            Comment


            • Since it's again been awhile, someone new looking in may know of examples.

              Comment


              • I don't know specifically about Hebrew/Aramaic. But I do know Latin. And a decent Latin grammar will tell you that when counting days, they would count the day of the event as the first day. So two days after that would be called the "third day after".

                For example:

                "The day before the Calends, Nones, or Ides of any month is designated as prīdiē Kalendās, Nōnās, Īdūs. The second day before was designated as diē tertiō ante Kalendās, Nōnās, etc. Similarly the third day before was designated as diē quārtō, and so on. These designations are arithmetically inaccurate, but the Romans reckoned both ends of the series. The Roman numeral indicating the date is therefore always larger by one than the actual number of days before Nones, Ides, or Calends."
                --New Latin Grammar, Charles E. Bennett.
                http://www.thelatinlibrary.com/bennett.html

                "tertio" there means "third"
                "quarto" means "fourth"

                To give an example:
                January 1 is the Kalends of January
                December 31 was called pridie Kalendas Januarias
                December 30 was called "die tertio ante Kalendas Januarias". That is, "on the third day before Jan 1".
                December 29 was called "die quarto ante Kalendas Januarias": "on the fourth day before Jan 1".

                The same with days after an event.

                I'm not as familiar with Greek, but I suspect it is the same there. Greek and Latin shared a lot with each other.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by rstrats View Post
                  Since it's again been awhile, someone new looking in may know of examples.
                  I don't know why Sparko reopened this thread, but this was answered for you by me last year in post #123. I gave you direct quotes from highly renown commentarians that directly answered your question. In your agreement with me you promised to drop the matter once I answered your question, which I did. So...stop.

                  Comment


                  • Esther did not wait a full three days and three nights. She went to the king on the third day. So that would be two days plus a number of hours.


                    Which would be less than 72 hours but more than 48 hours- and wholly commensurate with Hebrew usage. Whereas, Friday noon til Sunday 6am (appreciably longer than the traditional Friday late afternoon til Sunday 6am) would be only 42 hours: not commensurate with Hebrew usage for "three days and three nights."

                    So RStrats question in the OP

                    I wonder if anyone (who thinks that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week and who thinks that the "heart of the earth" means the tomb) knows of any writing that shows that a phrase stating a specific number of days as well as a specific number of nights was ever used in the first century or before when it absolutely couldn't have included at least parts of each one of the specific number of days and at least parts of each one of the specific number of nights?


                    has its answer: there are none.
                    Last edited by tabibito; 10-31-2017, 10:17 PM.
                    1Cor 15:34 Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
                    .
                    ⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛
                    Scripture before Tradition:
                    but that won't prevent others from
                    taking it upon themselves to deprive you
                    of the right to call yourself Christian.

                    ⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛

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                    • Adrift,
                      re: "... this was answered for you by me last year in post #123. I gave you direct quotes from highly renown commentarians..."


                      But none of the quotes provided any examples that showed that it was common to say that a daytime or a night time would be involved with an event when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could occur.

                      So let me ask you:

                      1, Do you believe in a 6th day of the week crucifixion/1st day of the week resurrection?

                      2. If your answer is yes, do you also believe that the "heart of the earth" is referring to the tomb?

                      3. If your answer to the first two is yes, do you try to explain the lack of a 3rd night by saying that the Messiah was employing common coloquial language of the time?

                      If you can't say yes to all three questions then this topic is not directed to you.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by rstrats View Post
                        Adrift,
                        re: "... this was answered for you by me last year in post #123. I gave you direct quotes from highly renown commentarians..."


                        But none of the quotes provided any examples that showed that it was common to say that a daytime or a night time would be involved with an event when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could occur.

                        So let me ask you:

                        1, Do you believe in a 6th day of the week crucifixion/1st day of the week resurrection?

                        2. If your answer is yes, do you also believe that the "heart of the earth" is referring to the tomb?

                        3. If your answer to the first two is yes, do you try to explain the lack of a 3rd night by saying that the Messiah was employing common coloquial language of the time?

                        If you can't say yes to all three questions then this topic is not directed to you.
                        Even if it's true that it doesn't show what you want it to show, there isn't any other answer. We discussed this multiple times after the fact. What I gave you is all there is. That's it. You've been posting this same question around the internet for ages now, and the answer I provided is all there is. You will never get the sort of answer that you're looking for because as we all know, you don't want an answer. You want to play "stump the Christian". Go back to post #123. That's the closest to an answer that you can possibly get on this question. There isn't anything else.


                        Also please use the quote function as we agreed to earlier. Per our agreement, I will again request the thread to be closed for you.
                        Last edited by Adrift; 11-01-2017, 09:18 AM.

                        Comment


                        • It appears that there isn't going to be anyone visiting this forum who believes:
                          1. That the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week.
                          2. That the "heart of the earth" refers to the tomb.
                          3. That the Messiah in Matthew 12:40 is employing common figure of speach/colloquial language.

                          So I shall move on and not take up anymore bandwidth.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by rstrats View Post
                            It appears that there isn't going to be anyone visiting this forum who believes:
                            1. That the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week.
                            2. That the "heart of the earth" refers to the tomb.
                            3. That the Messiah in Matthew 12:40 is employing common figure of speach/colloquial language.

                            So I shall move on and not take up anymore bandwidth.
                            No one visiting here has been able to convince YOU of this to YOUR satisfaction.

                            But this does NOT mean that no one visiting here believes it.
                            "Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." – Albert Einstein

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by rstrats View Post
                              It appears that there isn't going to be anyone visiting this forum who believes:
                              1. That the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week.
                              2. That the "heart of the earth" refers to the tomb.
                              3. That the Messiah in Matthew 12:40 is employing common figure of speach/colloquial language.

                              So I shall move on and not take up anymore bandwidth.
                              Very interesting. You must have an astounding ability to read minds. If I say I believe X but can't convince you that X is true, then you know that I don't really believe X.

                              Comment


                              • Since it's been a couple of years, perhaps there maybe someone new visiting this topic who might know of examples.

                                Comment

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