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Christianity and the Origin of Sanskrit

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  • #31
    Originally posted by Adrift View Post
    Guess it was just too hard for him to come out with it.
    I am not sure of your point presenting an extreme case for what? argument. Nihilists and many Vedic Hindus acknowledge they have thoughts and knowledge, they just believe ultimately all is illusion and not real.

    Everyone who rational chooses a philosophy or worldview bases it on knowledge on acquires in their life time, and education. A nihilist is not born a Nihilist.
    Last edited by shunyadragon; 01-23-2015, 09:20 PM.
    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
      NO
      So, you agree with the Wikipedia article and the dictionary definition of a Nihilist, but you also deny the substance of the quotes I presented? You're not making a whole lot of sense here shunya.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
        I am not sure of your point presenting an extreme case for what? argument. Nihilists and many Vedic Hindus acknowledge they have thoughts and knowledge, they just believe ultimately all is illusion and not real.

        Everyone who rational chooses a philosophy or worldview bases it on knowledge on acquires in their life time, and education. A nihilist is not born a Nihilist.
        So you DO disagree with these citations...

        Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nihilism

        Nihilism can also take epistemological or ontological/metaphysical forms, meaning respectively that, in some aspect, knowledge is not possible, or that reality does not actually exist.

        © Copyright Original Source




        Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nihilism

        Nihilism of an epistemological form can be seen as an extreme form of skepticism in which all knowledge is denied.[8]

        © Copyright Original Source

        Comment


        • #34
          What's the difference between post 26, and post 23?
          Does he who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you do so by works of the law, or by hearing with faith? -Galatians 3:5

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by Adrift View Post
            So you DO disagree with these citations...

            Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nihilism

            Nihilism can also take epistemological or ontological/metaphysical forms, meaning respectively that, in some aspect, knowledge is not possible, or that reality does not actually exist.

            © Copyright Original Source




            Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nihilism

            Nihilism of an epistemological form can be seen as an extreme form of skepticism in which all knowledge is denied.[8]

            © Copyright Original Source

            No, I agree with them. They do reflect what they believe, but they do not reflect their knowledge.

            Again, I am not sure of your point presenting an extreme case for what? argument. Nihilists and many Vedic Hindus acknowledge they have thoughts and knowledge, they just believe ultimately all is illusion and not real.

            Everyone who rational chooses a philosophy or worldview bases it on knowledge on acquires in their life time, and education. A nihilist is not born a Nihilist.
            Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
            Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
            But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

            go with the flow the river knows . . .

            Frank

            I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by Pentecost View Post
              What's the difference between post 26, and post 23?
              Good question, Post 23 is a bit confusing. Post 26 answers the question.

              No, I do not disagree with this at all. Again . . .

              The Nihilist does not believe knowledge does not exist. He may believe nothing in reality exists or some version that anything beyond the physical existence does not exist, but that is the belief of the Nihilist, and not the knowledge of the Nihilist.

              You are citing the belief about knowledge, not the knowledge that the Nihilist has in his brain, about the world around them. Like forms of Hinduism that deny knowledge and the existence is real, but that does not deny their ability to personally have knowledge about the world around them, they communicate with this illusion around them, and that they believe in reality it is an illusion or not real.

              Quote is as is, read it simply.

              My original statement reflects that everyone has some knowledge (in their brain, thoughts, mind, or whatever) regardless of what they profess to believe concerning the nature of our physical or spiritual existence, and of course belief and or non-belief in God, but it does not represent the complete true nature of God. What they decide to believe is based on their culture, what they are taught or their rational knowledge to make decisions and choices. Nihilist decide to believe that knowledge and everything else is in some way an illusion and does not exist. This is the conclusion of their 'belief,' and not the knowledge they have acquired in their lifetime.

              Actually many Christians share a similar belief that we have an innate knowledge in God regardless of what they profess to believe. I am not proposing this view, just that humans have knowledge of many things regardless of the beliefs they profess.
              Last edited by shunyadragon; 01-24-2015, 08:31 PM.
              Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
              Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
              But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

              go with the flow the river knows . . .

              Frank

              I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                Good question, Post 23 is a bit confusing. Post 26 answers the question.

                No, I do not disagree with this at all. Again . . .

                The Nihilist does not believe knowledge does not exist. He may believe nothing in reality exists or some version that anything beyond the physical existence does not exist, but that is the belief of the Nihilist, and not the knowledge of the Nihilist.

                You are citing the belief about knowledge, not the knowledge that the Nihilist has in his brain, about the world around them. Like forms of Hinduism that deny knowledge and the existence is real, but that does not deny their ability to personally have knowledge about the world around them, they communicate with this illusion around them, and that they believe in reality it is an illusion or not real.

                Quote is as is, read it simply.

                My original statement reflects that everyone has some knowledge (in their brain, thoughts, mind, or whatever) regardless of what they profess to believe concerning the nature of our physical or spiritual existence, and of course belief and or non-belief in God, but it does not represent the complete true nature of God. What they decide to believe is based on their culture, what they are taught or their rational knowledge to make decisions and choices. Nihilist decide to believe that knowledge and everything else is in some way an illusion and does not exist. This is the conclusion of their 'belief,' and not the knowledge they have acquired in their lifetime.

                Actually many Christians share a similar belief that we have an innate knowledge in God regardless of what they profess to believe. I am not proposing this view, just that humans have knowledge of many things regardless of the beliefs they profess.
                I think its accurate to say that the only one who was confused by my post #23 was you. You seem to be agreeing with me, even though your reply in post #24 attempted to refute it when you wrote "The Nihilist does not believe knowledge does not exist."

                I think what likely happened is that you were wrong about what you thought Nihilists believed, and then when I posted my reply in post #25, instead of admitting your mistake you pretended like you meant something else.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by Adrift View Post
                  I think its accurate to say that the only one who was confused by my post #23 was you. You seem to be agreeing with me, even though your reply in post #24 attempted to refute it when you wrote "The Nihilist does not believe knowledge does not exist."

                  I think what likely happened is that you were wrong about what you thought Nihilists believed, and then when I posted my reply in post #25, instead of admitting your mistake you pretended like you meant something else.
                  The Nihilists believe as defined in your references, and this does not reflect the knowledge Nihilists possess. You have not responded to my posts concerning the relationship of knowledge and belief..
                  Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                  Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                  But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                  go with the flow the river knows . . .

                  Frank

                  I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                    The Nihilists believe as defined in your references, and this does not reflect the knowledge Nihilists possess.
                    Then how come when I repeated this exact idea in post #23 you attempted to refute me in post #24 and out and out disagreed with me in post #30?

                    You have not responded to my posts concerning the relationship of knowledge and belief..
                    I didn't realize you were expecting a response. Can you show me the post where you asked me a question expecting a response?

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Adrift View Post
                      I think its accurate to say that the only one who was confused by my post #23 was you. You seem to be agreeing with me, even though your reply in post #24 attempted to refute it when you wrote "The Nihilist does not believe knowledge does not exist."

                      I think what likely happened is that you were wrong about what you thought Nihilists believed, and then when I posted my reply in post #25, instead of admitting your mistake you pretended like you meant something else.
                      You stated in $23 that Nihilist 'deny they do . . . have knowledge,' which is not correct. The definitions define the ultimate nature of knowledge and reality from the Nihilist perspective, and does not say the Nihilist 'denies they have knowledge.'.

                      Nihilist doe not deny they have knowledge. They of course have knowledge of their own philosophy, their life, and the knowledge they acquired over time. Nihilist consider the nature of this knowledge as ultimately an illusion as with everything physical.
                      Last edited by shunyadragon; 01-26-2015, 07:25 AM.
                      Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                      Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                      But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                      go with the flow the river knows . . .

                      Frank

                      I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                        You stated in $23 that Nihilist 'deny their knowledge,' which is not correct.
                        What? No I didn't. I asked you if a Nihilist has knowledge even if they deny that knowledge exists.

                        And then you replied to me and said that a Nihilist does not believe knowledge does not exist.

                        So then I asked you if you agreed with the Wikipedia article that states that Nihilists believe knowledge does not exist.

                        And you said that you did not disagree with the Wikipedia article.

                        And then in post #31 you essentially repeated my exact statement in post #23, even though in post #30 you said you disagreed with my post #23.

                        Are you even reading the posts in this thread? What is wrong with you?

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Adrift View Post
                          What? No I didn't. I asked you if a Nihilist has knowledge even if they deny that knowledge exists.
                          First, plain English as to what you actually said in post #23:

                          So what you're saying is that the nihilist who believes that knowledge does not exist or that it is a fantasy really does know something even if they deny that they do.
                          If you intended to say something different reword it so that it says something different.

                          As I stated before they do not 'deny that they do [have knowledge]. They believe that that knowledge and reality is ultimately an illusion or does not exist.
                          Last edited by shunyadragon; 01-26-2015, 08:20 AM.
                          Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                          Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                          But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                          go with the flow the river knows . . .

                          Frank

                          I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Adrift View Post
                            So then I asked you if you agreed with the Wikipedia article that states that Nihilists believe knowledge does not exist.

                            And you said that you did not disagree with the Wikipedia article.
                            True

                            And then in post #31 you essentially repeated my exact statement in post #23, even though in post #30 you said you disagreed with my post #23.
                            Quote me directly and NOT what you think I 'essentially' said. I did not agree with post #23, as I stated in the previous post.
                            Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                            Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                            But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                            go with the flow the river knows . . .

                            Frank

                            I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                              First, plain English as to what you actually said in post #23:



                              If you intended to say something different reword it so that it says something different.
                              shunya, my English was fine. People on this forum are constantly telling you that you are the one with reading comprehension issues. Why do you think they keep saying that? Do you honestly believe that everyone else is unclear, and it is you with the better grasp of English?
                              Last edited by Adrift; 01-26-2015, 08:31 AM.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                                True



                                Quote me directly and NOT what you think I 'essentially' said. I did not agree with post #23, as I stated in the previous post.
                                If I attempted to quote you directly every time I replied to you we'd end up with needlessly complicated and extremely wordy posts that wouldn't make a whole lot of sense. You don't quote me every time you reply to me, why should I have to quote you every time I reply to you? And even when you directly quote me as you did two posts up, you still got what I said wrong.

                                Do you or do you not agree that Nihilists deny that knowledge exists?

                                Do you or do you not agree that Nihilists have knowledge despite the fact that they may deny that knowledge exists?

                                Comment

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