Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 28

Thread: Two bloods.

  1. #1
    tWebber
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    68
    Amen (Given)
    0
    Amen (Received)
    3

    Two bloods.

    But how does excluding one gender for a virgin birth in your terminology help if "the main part of my creation is from a male and a female, both of whom are full of iniquity" to quote Rashi. . . If God needs a sinless Mary, and an absent father to produce Jesus, there is neither normal male nor normal female involved. The whole thing is a charade. It's not "male" that's being excluded, but "human". In which case, why the convoluted story with Mary and Joseph at all?
    Mary is not sinless since sin infects every cell of every body (save one: the seed of the woman after meiotic cleansing). The female seed throws off half of it's chromosomes in the process that makes the seed of the woman the only cell in the human body that has no sin. The male seed doesn't throw off half of its chromosomes. The splitting in preparation for uniting with the seed of the woman doesn't include any loss as in the case of the seed of the woman. One male seed splits into four semen with no loss of material.

    Biologist have struggled to understand why the female seed throws off part of its material. They suggest there doesn't seem to be any purpose to it. But it's the most important process in the entire reproductive system. Without it, Genesis 3:15 would have no fulfillment.

    Jewish sages have discussed the difference between circumcision blood versus menstrual blood: one is clean and purifying (circumcision blood) while the other is unclean and contaminating (niddah: menstrual blood).

    But why?

    In meiotic cleansing, the female seed causes a cross-over of all sin into half of its mass that's thrown of during menstruation. The sin is in the blood that leaves the body with the sinful 23 chromosomes. It's sinful blood: niddah. . . But the ovum is now purified, clean, the only clean cell in the human body. But the male seed doesn't cleanse itself. The male seed remains contaminated with sin. . . So why is circumcision blood clean, and menstrual blood contaminated?

    The answer lies in something Rabbi L. Hoffman points out in his book on the covenant of blood. He explains that circumcision blood is not just clean, but a cleaner . . . a cleanser. According to Rabbi Hoffman, it can save. It's salvific. Once it's understood that circumcision blood is salvific, it cleans, cleanses, saves, it becomes apparent why circumcision blood, unlike menstrual blood, is not contaminated with sin. Menstrual blood cleanses the ovum by sacrificing half of its material in meiotic cleansing. Once the sin is in the blood, and the blood is removed from the body, the ovum is pure, and the sin is outside the body (in the menstrual blood).

    The male reproductive system cleanses itself from sin simply by allowing the female ovum, purified through menstruation, to remain pure. In other words, the blood of the phallus (circumcision blood) is ritually pure since in the ritual it represents emasculation, which saves the purified ovum from re-contamination. In the two part process, the ovum throws off sin in the menstrual blood, making the blood niddah, contaminated, unclean (infested with sin) . . . while the cutting of the phallus, creating circumcision blood, rather than throwing off sin, throws off the means by which every single ovum but one in human history has been recontaminated after the menstrual cleansing process.

    According to many Jewish sages, the difference between menstrual blood and circumcision blood is that menstrual blood is about nature while circumcision blood is under the control of the Jewish male. The controlled nature of circumcision blood, versus the uncontrolled, natural, nature of the blood of the niddah (menstruant) is part and parcel of the reason circumcision blood is good, and menstrual blood bad. This fits nicely with what's being presented since through postlapsarian nature every single birth leads inevitably to death. Without the act of a Jewish male (Abraham) nature would abide in death not just till kingdom come --- since it wouldn't ---- but forever and ever world without end.

    The act of a human being --- Abraham --- thwarted death once and for all. Which is to say that by an "un-natural" act ---- symbolically removing an organ designed by god (the ultimate act of antinomian desecration) ----a man, a human being, upset the apple-cart of postlapsarian nature. Abraham symbolically took back from nature what nature stole from man in the Fall. In the Fall nature usurped man's divine authority over nature. Man became subject to nature --- and natural death. But when Abraham took hold of the organ most under control of natural passions, and in an act of Passion, bled it to death, he symbolically ended nature's reign over mankind, returning mankind, symbolically, to the Garden of Eden.

    What Abraham accomplished in ritual form, God made real with the birth of the first child born in the actuality of what Abraham performed ritually.

    Only through the virgin birth of Jesus of Nazareth could any one appreciate the ritual purity of circumcision blood. It's ritually pure because in the ritual it represents the end of nature's reign of terror whereby by use of the greatest of passions, nature passes on death over and over again. And this, through the organ most under control of nature's passions.

    In the spiritual Passion of Abraham, the blood of nature's favored organ became the mark on the human body signifying the end of nature's reign. The mark became more than merely a ritual mark when the blood Abraham spilled spilled onto the pages of the New Torah, which was written not by the "natural" amanuensis and scribe of God: the firstborn creature who usurped the birth order by coming out of the womb of creation ahead of Adam, but by a son of Adam, a Son of Man, who, is the true Firstborn of God's Creation, the firstfruits of all those who he will rescue from natural death.



    XR

  2. #2
    Must...have...caffeine One Bad Pig's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Inside the beltway
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    12,774
    Amen (Given)
    4368
    Amen (Received)
    7418
    Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

    Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio

    I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

  3. Amen Christianbookworm, Leonhard, Jedidiah amen'd this post.
  4. #3
    Professor KingsGambit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Next to you
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    7,559
    Amen (Given)
    1273
    Amen (Received)
    3283
    However we understand sin nature, I have to think that invoking modern biological concepts is going to be "missing the mark" (sorry, couldn't resist the pun).
    Something is always happening, but when it happens, people don't always see it, or understand it... or accept it.

  5. #4
    tWebber shunyadragon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Hillsborough, NC
    Faith
    Agnostic
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    11,628
    Amen (Given)
    1002
    Amen (Received)
    718
    Quote Originally Posted by Xtian Rabinovich View Post
    Mary is not sinless since sin infects every cell of every body (save one: the seed of the woman after meiotic cleansing). The female seed throws off half of it's chromosomes in the process that makes the seed of the woman the only cell in the human body that has no sin. The male seed doesn't throw off half of its chromosomes. The splitting in preparation for uniting with the seed of the woman doesn't include any loss as in the case of the seed of the woman. One male seed splits into four semen with no loss of material.

    Biologist have struggled to understand why the female seed throws off part of its material. They suggest there doesn't seem to be any purpose to it. But it's the most important process in the entire reproductive system. Without it, Genesis 3:15 would have no fulfillment.

    Jewish sages have discussed the difference between circumcision blood versus menstrual blood: one is clean and purifying (circumcision blood) while the other is unclean and contaminating (niddah: menstrual blood).

    But why?

    In meiotic cleansing, the female seed causes a cross-over of all sin into half of its mass that's thrown of during menstruation. The sin is in the blood that leaves the body with the sinful 23 chromosomes. It's sinful blood: niddah. . . But the ovum is now purified, clean, the only clean cell in the human body. But the male seed doesn't cleanse itself. The male seed remains contaminated with sin. . . So why is circumcision blood clean, and menstrual blood contaminated?

    The answer lies in something Rabbi L. Hoffman points out in his book on the covenant of blood. He explains that circumcision blood is not just clean, but a cleaner . . . a cleanser. According to Rabbi Hoffman, it can save. It's salvific. Once it's understood that circumcision blood is salvific, it cleans, cleanses, saves, it becomes apparent why circumcision blood, unlike menstrual blood, is not contaminated with sin. Menstrual blood cleanses the ovum by sacrificing half of its material in meiotic cleansing. Once the sin is in the blood, and the blood is removed from the body, the ovum is pure, and the sin is outside the body (in the menstrual blood).

    The male reproductive system cleanses itself from sin simply by allowing the female ovum, purified through menstruation, to remain pure. In other words, the blood of the phallus (circumcision blood) is ritually pure since in the ritual it represents emasculation, which saves the purified ovum from re-contamination. In the two part process, the ovum throws off sin in the menstrual blood, making the blood niddah, contaminated, unclean (infested with sin) . . . while the cutting of the phallus, creating circumcision blood, rather than throwing off sin, throws off the means by which every single ovum but one in human history has been recontaminated after the menstrual cleansing process.

    According to many Jewish sages, the difference between menstrual blood and circumcision blood is that menstrual blood is about nature while circumcision blood is under the control of the Jewish male. The controlled nature of circumcision blood, versus the uncontrolled, natural, nature of the blood of the niddah (menstruant) is part and parcel of the reason circumcision blood is good, and menstrual blood bad. This fits nicely with what's being presented since through postlapsarian nature every single birth leads inevitably to death. Without the act of a Jewish male (Abraham) nature would abide in death not just till kingdom come --- since it wouldn't ---- but forever and ever world without end.

    The act of a human being --- Abraham --- thwarted death once and for all. Which is to say that by an "un-natural" act ---- symbolically removing an organ designed by god (the ultimate act of antinomian desecration) ----a man, a human being, upset the apple-cart of postlapsarian nature. Abraham symbolically took back from nature what nature stole from man in the Fall. In the Fall nature usurped man's divine authority over nature. Man became subject to nature --- and natural death. But when Abraham took hold of the organ most under control of natural passions, and in an act of Passion, bled it to death, he symbolically ended nature's reign over mankind, returning mankind, symbolically, to the Garden of Eden.

    What Abraham accomplished in ritual form, God made real with the birth of the first child born in the actuality of what Abraham performed ritually.

    Only through the virgin birth of Jesus of Nazareth could any one appreciate the ritual purity of circumcision blood. It's ritually pure because in the ritual it represents the end of nature's reign of terror whereby by use of the greatest of passions, nature passes on death over and over again. And this, through the organ most under control of nature's passions.

    In the spiritual Passion of Abraham, the blood of nature's favored organ became the mark on the human body signifying the end of nature's reign. The mark became more than merely a ritual mark when the blood Abraham spilled spilled onto the pages of the New Torah, which was written not by the "natural" amanuensis and scribe of God: the firstborn creature who usurped the birth order by coming out of the womb of creation ahead of Adam, but by a son of Adam, a Son of Man, who, is the true Firstborn of God's Creation, the firstfruits of all those who he will rescue from natural death.



    XR
    A rather contorted contrived explanation.
    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

  6. Amen Cow Poke, Cerealman, Leonhard, Jedidiah amen'd this post.
  7. #5
    Dept. of Redundancy Dept. Cow Poke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    The Republic of Texas
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    32,692
    Amen (Given)
    7513
    Amen (Received)
    17322
    Quote Originally Posted by Xtian Rabinovich View Post
    Mary is not sinless since sin infects every cell of every body
    Is this your original work?

    1 Tim 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

  8. #6
    tWebber 37818's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    So. California
    Faith
    Nontraditional Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    4,038
    Amen (Given)
    740
    Amen (Received)
    368
    This thread is inane.

    Man has a sinful nature because man obtained God's knowledge of good and evil in the disobedience (Genesis 3:22). While man was created good, man is only finite good. God is infinite good. Any knowledge of evil corrupts finite good. No amount of evil can corrupt infinite good.

    Now Jesus being born of a human Mother is then also a descendent from Adam. Receiving the inheritance of what causes the sinful nature in men. But because Jesus is the Son of God, being God in the flesh, that same knowledge of good and evil which causes the sinful nature, was always part of His eternal divine nature. So Jesus who was fully man would not sin because He also was fully God in the flesh (Hebrews 4:15; Mark 10:18).
    Last edited by 37818; 02-16-2015 at 09:01 PM.
    . . . the Gospel of Christ, for it is [the] power of God to salvation to every [one] believing, . . . -- Romans 1:16.

    . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3, 4.

    Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1.

  9. #7
    Dept. of Redundancy Dept. Cow Poke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    The Republic of Texas
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    32,692
    Amen (Given)
    7513
    Amen (Received)
    17322
    Quote Originally Posted by 37818 View Post
    This thread is inane.
    And quite possibly plagiarized.

    1 Tim 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

  10. Amen Jedidiah amen'd this post.
  11. #8
    tWebber
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    68
    Amen (Given)
    0
    Amen (Received)
    3
    Hi Shunyadragon,

    A rather contorted contrived explanation.
    I should suppose so if you're new to this sort of thing . . . .



    XR

  12. #9
    tWebber
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    68
    Amen (Given)
    0
    Amen (Received)
    3
    Hi Cow Poke,

    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    And quite possibly plagiarized.
    Thank you. I take that as a compliment.



    XR

  13. #10
    Dept. of Redundancy Dept. Cow Poke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    The Republic of Texas
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    32,692
    Amen (Given)
    7513
    Amen (Received)
    17322
    Quote Originally Posted by Xtian Rabinovich View Post
    Hi Cow Poke,



    Thank you. I take that as a compliment.



    XR
    Unless it's your original work, it's a violation of decorum, and you will receive infraction points.

    So, I ask again - in my official role as moderator - is this your original work?

    1 Tim 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •