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State Dep't says ISIS fighters need jobs, not killing

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  • #91
    Originally posted by Paprika View Post
    Get your priorities straight
    That too!
    If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

    Comment


    • #92
      Originally posted by Sam View Post
      That's completely 1) unrealistic, 2) irresponsible, and 3) disproportionate to the threat. ISIS isn't bloody Germany, nor does it have any capacity to become such a threat.
      Not yet, the Nazis were not a formidable force in the mid 1920s. And ISIS is growing in leaps and bounds, some estimates have their numbers up to a hundred thousand. Conservative estimates have them around 50,000 - which is far higher than just two years ago. So you can bury your head in the sand Sam, but they are brutal, growing and well funded.
      Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

      Comment


      • #93
        So... kick their tails now, or wait 15-20 years and then kick their tails?
        If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

        Comment


        • #94
          Originally posted by Christianbookworm View Post
          So... kick their tails now, or wait 15-20 years and then kick their tails?
          3) Let Iran kick their tails.

          Comment


          • #95
            Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post
            Yes, Sam. I did address your statement. ISIS is not just a violent extremist group. They are far more organized and have eclipsed the achievements of nearly every other group that Bush Sr considered. The article I cited went into great detail on just what that entails and the possible ramifications of underestimating their fortitude and objectives. ISIS has zero do to with jobs or poverty.
            You had not accused me of shilling for Obama or the Democrats saying stupid things and so were not part of the cadre I was referring to. Sparko, CP, Crystal were the principle offenders in mind.
            "I wonder about the trees. / Why do we wish to bear / Forever the noise of these / More than another noise / So close to our dwelling place?" — Robert Frost, "The Sound of Trees"

            Comment


            • #96
              Originally posted by Sam View Post
              You had not accused me of shilling for Obama or the Democrats saying stupid things and so were not part of the cadre I was referring to. Sparko, CP, Crystal were the principle offenders in mind.
              Walks like it, talks like it, quacks like it......
              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

              Comment


              • #97
                Originally posted by seer View Post
                Not yet, the Nazis were not a formidable force in the mid 1920s. And ISIS is growing in leaps and bounds, some estimates have their numbers up to a hundred thousand. Conservative estimates have them around 50,000 - which is far higher than just two years ago. So you can bury your head in the sand Sam, but they are brutal, growing and well funded.
                Conservative estimates have the number at 20,000 - 30,000 with 5% - 10% of the force being killed off every week or two. And ISIS never has had and never will have the economic engine that made Germany a strong military force — nothing remotely close to it, in fact.

                Germany took Poland. ISIS can't even take Kobane. Germany blitzkrieged, taking great swaths of populated land. ISIS can barely hold on the mostly unpopulated land it already has.

                A serious response to the threat requires a serious analysis, not hyperbolic, non-factual nuttery. When you're pitching war — something that will necessarily commit many people, military and civilian, to death, you have a responsibility to sit down and think straight before you push ahead. You're not doing that.

                —Sam
                "I wonder about the trees. / Why do we wish to bear / Forever the noise of these / More than another noise / So close to our dwelling place?" — Robert Frost, "The Sound of Trees"

                Comment


                • #98
                  Originally posted by Sam View Post
                  Conservative estimates have the number at 20,000 - 30,000 with 5% - 10% of the force being killed off every week or two. And ISIS never has had and never will have the economic engine that made Germany a strong military force — nothing remotely close to it, in fact.
                  Even 30,000 is like 10 times bigger than it was just two years ago. They are still in their early days, the Nazis didn't even have nearly the same power or influence that early on.

                  Germany took Poland. ISIS can't even take Kobane. Germany blitzkrieged, taking great swaths of populated land. ISIS can barely hold on the mostly unpopulated land it already has.
                  Yes, the Nazis gained power - after 10-12 years.

                  A serious response to the threat requires a serious analysis, not hyperbolic, non-factual nuttery. When you're pitching war — something that will necessarily commit many people, military and civilian, to death, you have a responsibility to sit down and think straight before you push ahead. You're not doing that.

                  —Sam
                  So it is better to wait and allow ISIS to grown in numbers and power as they have done these past few years than to stop them now?
                  Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    Originally posted by seer View Post
                    Even 30,000 is like 10 times bigger than it was just two years ago. They are still in their early days, the Nazis didn't even have nearly the same power or influence that early on.



                    Yes, the Nazis gained power - after 10-12 years.



                    So it is better to wait and allow ISIS to grown in numbers and power as they have done these past few years than to stop them now?
                    How do you stop them now? They keep hiding in civilian areas!
                    If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Sam View Post
                      Conservative estimates have the number at 20,000 - 30,000 with 5% - 10% of the force being killed off every week or two. And ISIS never has had and never will have the economic engine that made Germany a strong military force — nothing remotely close to it, in fact.

                      Germany took Poland. ISIS can't even take Kobane. Germany blitzkrieged, taking great swaths of populated land. ISIS can barely hold on the mostly unpopulated land it already has.

                      A serious response to the threat requires a serious analysis, not hyperbolic, non-factual nuttery. When you're pitching war — something that will necessarily commit many people, military and civilian, to death, you have a responsibility to sit down and think straight before you push ahead. You're not doing that.

                      —Sam
                      Thank you, Neville Chamberlain.

                      The error you make is thinking it's "all out war" or "what Obama's doing".

                      There is a LOT in between.
                      The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Christianbookworm View Post
                        How do you stop them now? They keep hiding in civilian areas!
                        That is why we have Marines.
                        Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by seer View Post
                          Even 30,000 is like 10 times bigger than it was just two years ago. They are still in their early days, the Nazis didn't even have nearly the same power or influence that early on.



                          Yes, the Nazis gained power - after 10-12 years.



                          So it is better to wait and allow ISIS to grown in numbers and power as they have done these past few years than to stop them now?
                          And $30,000/year salary is ten times more than $3000/year salary. Doesn't mean you can suddenly buy a jet with your 10x earnings. Trying to argue that ISIS' ranks are exponentially growing such that they can be a world player in 10-20-40 years is just patently absurd. There's nothing remotely suggesting that ISIS is capable of that growth. And there's certainly nothing suggesting that it's capable of sustaining much higher growth. If all you have is fearmongering decades down the line and Goodwin's law, you're being irresponsible in your advocacy of war.
                          "I wonder about the trees. / Why do we wish to bear / Forever the noise of these / More than another noise / So close to our dwelling place?" — Robert Frost, "The Sound of Trees"

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by seer View Post
                            That is why we have Marines.
                            AND others!
                            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Sam View Post
                              And $30,000/year salary is ten times more than $3000/year salary. Doesn't mean you can suddenly buy a jet with your 10x earnings. Trying to argue that ISIS' ranks are exponentially growing such that they can be a world player in 10-20-40 years is just patently absurd. There's nothing remotely suggesting that ISIS is capable of that growth. And there's certainly nothing suggesting that it's capable of sustaining much higher growth. If all you have is fearmongering decades down the line and Goodwin's law, you're being irresponsible in your advocacy of war.
                              well one thing to consider is that in WW2 you really needed an industrial base to wage war, because you had to build tanks, bombs, guns, etc. Today all a group really needs is to gain access to some bio weapons or nuclear material. ISIS is exactly the type of group that would use such weapons if they gain access to them.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                                Thank you, Neville Chamberlain.

                                The error you make is thinking it's "all out war" or "what Obama's doing".

                                There is a LOT in between.

                                What, exactly, am I proposing in terms of appeasement, again?

                                And what, exactly, has anyone here suggested that finds a line between "what Obama's doing" and "all out war"? I specifically asked for a military solution that -didn't- end up as a ground war. Seer came closest, arguing for limited shock troops but immediately acknowledged that he'd be talking all-out war as soon as a couple servicemen were captured and killed.
                                "I wonder about the trees. / Why do we wish to bear / Forever the noise of these / More than another noise / So close to our dwelling place?" — Robert Frost, "The Sound of Trees"

                                Comment

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