Did the people before Jesus get a free ticket to heaven?

[Mentalist]

For all those people who lived before Jesus, what happened to them according to Christians here?

I can currently conceive these possibilities: -

1) They had all their sin tickets go up in flames with the crucifixion and so they all get a free ride to heaven.

2) As none of them were Christians satan is toasting them like marshmallows as we speak.

3) Their sin and good deed tickets were totted up and if they scored better than a B- they go to heaven no matter what they believed.

I may well have missed some option(s), so suggest away if none of mine match.

Thanks.

[wiseman]

I would think that god would have judged people individually based on how they lived their lives and then decide upon that. If god truly is wise then he would do as I do.

[Mentalist]

If god truly is wise then he would do as I do.

That's what they all say.

Welcome to TWEB.

[shunyadragon]

For all those people who lived before Jesus, what happened to them according to Christians here?

I can currently conceive these possibilities: -

1) They had all their sin tickets go up in flames with the crucifixion and so they all get a free ride to heaven.

2) As none of them were Christians satan is toasting them like marshmallows as we speak.

3) Their sin and good deed tickets were totted up and if they scored better than a B- they go to heaven no matter what they believed.

I may well have missed some option(s), so suggest away if none of mine match.

Thanks.

Other possibilities -

Plan (A) They await in their graves for resurrection day when the just and righteous shall arise, and those not writen in the book will, ah . . . not rise . Not withstanding the false alarm where the saints woke up primaturally and wandered around Jeruselum telling every one the good news.

Plan (B) There in a holding pattern over the Tel Aviv airport waiting for more ethnic cleansing of the resident Arabs to make way for just and righteous return as settlers in the promised land.

Plan (C) God has other plans.

Pan (D) Dust to dust . . .

[wiseman]

That's what they all say.

Welcome to TWEB.

They may all say that but they are not me, and that is the difference.

Thanks for the welcome, I intend to pop up every now and again in various forums with wise words.

[shunyadragon]

I would think that god would have judged people individually based on how they lived their lives and then decide upon that. If god truly is wise then he would do as I do.

Nice warm fuzzy CS Lewis thought.

But, unfortunately that does not reflect what the Bible says.

[Mentalist]

Nice warm fuzzy CS Lewis thought.

But, unfortunately that does not reflect what the Bible says.

What does the bible say?

[Rationalist]

For all those people who lived before Jesus, what happened to them according to Christians here?

I can currently conceive these possibilities: -

1) They had all their sin tickets go up in flames with the crucifixion and so they all get a free ride to heaven.

2) As none of them were Christians satan is toasting them like marshmallows as we speak.

3) Their sin and good deed tickets were totted up and if they scored better than a B- they go to heaven no matter what they believed.

My vote would be for....

4) People who are already dead don't make for particularly good potential converts to Christianity.

The doctrines of any religion are those which make it possible to sell the religion to its target audience: potential new converts. For example, Christianity has a fantastic selling point with it's guilt elimination system. After all, who doesn't want to feel good about themselves and right with the world? The dead, however, don't convert, so it's not surprising that the obvious problem of those who lived and died before Christ would be overlooked.

Mormons do have an answer to this question. It involves baptising by proxy every single man, woman, and child on the face of the earth that ever lived.

[shunyadragon]

What does the bible say?

Oopha! Where to start.

The problem is the Bible gives many different conflicting criteria and reasons whether your toast or the host. The following are just a few points.

If you take the simple quote in chapter 20 of Revelation, you are judged 'according to your works', which gets your name in the good book, if not your barbecue, but ah . . . most Christians would not accept that, based on various provisos and clauses in the gospels and letters. Down the road churches quote scripture and tradition to set up their own standards as to who makes it and who do not get the ticket.

The OT makes this more problematic. Tribal affiliation or just being on the earth at the wrong time gets you zapped. The naughty and nice list does not apply here well at all. Many who curse get a second or more chances, but others get the bear treatment.

[wiseman]

Nice warm fuzzy CS Lewis thought.

But, unfortunately that does not reflect what the Bible says.

Then the bible and the god in it are not wise. Or not AS wise as myself and my good friend CS lewis.

[Rationalist]

Oopha! Where to start.

The problem is the Bible gives many different conflicting criteria and reasons whether your toast or the host. The following are just a few points.

If you take the simple quote in chapter 20 of Revelation, you are judged 'according to your works', which gets your name in the good book, if not your barbecue, but ah . . . most Christians would not accept that, based on various provisos and clauses in the gospels and letters. Down the road churches quote scripture and tradition to set up their own standards as to who makes it and who do not get the ticket.

The OT makes this more problematic. Tribal affiliation or just being on the earth at the wrong time gets you zapped. The naughty and nice list does not apply here well at all. Many who curse get a second or more chances, but others get the bear treatment.

What do you believe?

[gnosticmary]

For all those people who lived before Jesus, what happened to them according to Christians here?

I can currently conceive these possibilities: -

1) They had all their sin tickets go up in flames with the crucifixion and so they all get a free ride to heaven.

2) As none of them were Christians satan is toasting them like marshmallows as we speak.

3) Their sin and good deed tickets were totted up and if they scored better than a B- they go to heaven no matter what they believed.

I may well have missed some option(s), so suggest away if none of mine match.

Thanks.

I hope it is ok if i reply...i am a follower of the teachings of Jesus, but do not hold to any particular religion.

Those who were born before Jesus are redeemed in the same way that those who were born after Jesus are saved - through the receipt of God's Grace that comes as one denies self, picks up their cross and follows in the footsteps of those who have incarnated to show us the Way.

Redemption comes through the crucifixion of the ego self which humanity has been deluded into thinking is their true self, most having lost connection completely to their soul. Redemption comes when one believes in/trusts/follows only the only begotten son of God known in the English language as Christ, or Divine Love, and not trusting or believing in their separate self identity.

Moses and Elijah were redeemed previously to Jesus' incarnation and met with Him in their transfigured bodies.

Buddha was redeemed as were numerous Hindus of the past. Presently, it appears that no one is able to break through the increasing darkness of selfishness (certainly so if one considers Tweb a reflection of humanity) so that they may receive God's transfiguring Grace allowing them to enter into the Kingdom in this life.



Mary

[shunyadragon]

What do you believe?

Spock

Big question with so little space. I think following my posts will give most the answer, but I will respond to specific questions.

Concerning the Bible - It is primative spiritual literature from a limited worldview of god writen from a Hebrew/Babylonian/Egyptian perspective in the OT, and primarily a Roman perspective in the NT. The genre of the literature fits well within the worldview of the times it is writen, and not unique. Actually my favorite is Gilgamesh and my hero Enkido.

Concerning the journey beyond this life - The spiritual attributes and knowledge acquired in this world are what we have in whatever world that exists or does not exist beyond this one. Problem is most people prefer playing Trivial Pursuit and are more like obedient or rebelious hamsters on the wheel. My perspective is Baha'i/Buddhist, a realist with a spiritual perspective and a sense of humor.

[salvationfound]

For all those people who lived before Jesus, what happened to them according to Christians here?

I can currently conceive these possibilities: -

1) They had all their sin tickets go up in flames with the crucifixion and so they all get a free ride to heaven.

2) As none of them were Christians satan is toasting them like marshmallows as we speak.

3) Their sin and good deed tickets were totted up and if they scored better than a B- they go to heaven no matter what they believed.

I may well have missed some option(s), so suggest away if none of mine match.

Thanks.

I think every single person in the world is given what they personally need to
get into Heaven. Let's use brain damaged people as an example. They may
not be able to understand who Jesus was in the same way I can so does that
mean they go to Hell? No I don't believe that they are given enough
information to get them into Heaven. Everyone who has heard the message
of Jesus are those who needed to hear it in order to get their own personal
right relationship with God. Now whether or not you accept or reject what
you have heard is a different story.

[Mentalist]

I think every single person in the world is given what they personally need to
get into Heaven. Let's use brain damaged people as an example. They may
not be able to understand who Jesus was in the same way I can so does that
mean they go to Hell? No I don't believe that they are given enough
information to get them into Heaven. Everyone who has heard the message
of Jesus are those who needed to hear it in order to get their own personal
right relationship with God. Now whether or not you accept or reject what
you have heard is a different story.

Sorry, I'm afraid I didn't quite follow, I think there might be some missing punctuation. Are you suggesting that people who haven't heard of Jesus don't go to hell, but also don't go to heaven because they aren't given enough information? In which case, where do they go? Please correct me if I've got your position wrong.