Is God a thing

[Zarathustra]

?

[Straylight]

?

Is eternity a thing? What do you mean by "thing"? If you mean an object or body with it's own exclusive presence within the realms of space-time, then no, God is not a thing.

[{Tim}]

?

[Zarathustra]

Is eternity a thing?

Is God an eternity? - An eternity with properties.

What do you mean by "thing"? If you mean an object or body with it's own exclusive presence within the realms of space-time, then no, God is not a thing.

I was wandering if God is a thing with definable properties that exists within a fixed boundary. Like an individual object.

So not confined to space-time, but confined.

[Zarathustra]

This is the philosophy section.

[Straylight]

Is God an eternity? - An eternity with properties.

As far as Abrahamic traditions go, God is eternity. Not merely just an eternity or eternal or holding eternal properties. He is eternity and is synonymous with it.

"Hear, O Israel: The Eternal is our God, the Eternal is one" --- That's the basic meaning of the Name in the Hebrew scriptures (the verb for "to be" is related to the name YHWH), and the descriptor given in the story of Moses, "I am that I am", says as much as well.

Now, I understand that's in the realm of biblicism and/or a specific theology, but take it for what it's worth.

I was wandering if God is a thing with definable properties that exists within a fixed boundary. Like an individual object.

So not confined to space-time, but confined.

Well, he's not according to my tradition at least.

Philosophically speaking though, I can't really equate something with fixed boundaries to be God. That would mean the universe -- time and space -- are still greater, and so in turn, would be the greater God.

[Zarathustra]

As far as Abrahamic traditions go, God is eternity. Not merely just an eternity or eternal or holding eternal properties. He is eternity and is synonymous with it.

So God is the thing eternity. Any property that the thing has, are eternal because they are part of the eternity. Eternity has the property omnipotence. Thus omnipotence is something eternal.

So I am the thing human. Any property that the thing has, is human because they are part of the human. Human has the property consciousness. Thus consciousness is something human.

"Hear, O Israel: The Eternal is our God, the Eternal is one" --- That's the basic meaning of the Name in the Hebrew scriptures (the verb for "to be" is related to the name YHWH), and the descriptor given in the story of Moses, "I am that I am", says as much as well.

I am that I am, yet I am not God. God is then confined to at the very least not being me.

Now, I understand that's in the realm of biblicism and/or a specific theology, but take it for what it's worth.

Cheers

Well, he's not according to my tradition at least.

Philosophically speaking though, I can't really equate something with fixed boundaries to be God. That would mean the universe -- time and space -- are still greater, and so in turn, would be the greater God.

Yet the God of the bible is clearly not time and space, God is just the creator. While God is able to interact with time and space, God is confined to not being time and space. It may be the case that everything that is not time and space is God. This would make God a thing. Namely the thing that is not time and space but exists.

[sylvius]

As far as Abrahamic traditions go, God is eternity. Not merely just an eternity or eternal or holding eternal properties. He is eternity and is synonymous with it.

Eternity, Hebrew 'olam', written 'ayin-vav-lamed-mem', has different meanings.
It can also mean: assembly, community.

The same God that is here and now, in my local community, is also there in your community; in your everyday life; be you a Muslim, or an Atheist, or a drugs-addict or even a terrorist; and was also there 2000 years ago, or 40.000 years ago; in Africa, in China, or even on Mars.

This also why you can do 'teshuvah' -- you can step out the circle you used to live in, out of your old community, lifestyle, into a new.

"Hear, O Israel: The Eternal is our God, the Eternal is one" --- That's the basic meaning of the Name in the Hebrew scriptures (the verb for "to be" is related to the name YHWH), and the descriptor given in the story of Moses, "I am that I am", says as much as well.

This I can't get so well. "The Eternal" here is used to avoid mentioning the Name of God. this because of 'olam' is from root 'alam', to hide.

Rashi on Exodus 3:15,http://www.chabad.org/library/articl...showrashi=true
This is My name forever Heb. לְעֹלָם [It is spelled] without a vav, meaning: conceal it [God’s name] תהַעִלִימֵהוּ [so] that it should not be read as it is written. — [from Pes. 50a] Since the “vav” of (לְעֹלָ ם) is missing, we are to understand it as לְעַלֵּם, to conceal, meaning that the pronunciation of the way God’s name is written (י-ה-ו-ה) is to be concealed. — [from Pes. 50a.]
and this is how I should be mentioned - He [God] taught him [Moses] how it was to be read, and so does David say, “O Lord, Your name is forever; O Lord, the mention of Your name is for every generation” (Ps. 135:14). — [from Pes. 50a]

[QUOTE]

[Straylight]

The same God that is here and now

I never said that God wasn't. Eternity is here, everywhere, and beyond. It is both in the moment, and outside our time and presence. There is no "point A to B" or "here or there" in the concept of eternity: Rather, A is B and here is there.

[Zarathustra]

I never said that God wasn't. Eternity is here, everywhere, and beyond. It is both in the moment, and outside our time and presence. There is no "point A to B" or "here or there" in the concept of eternity: Rather, A is B and here is there.

So I am you and what I see is me?

[Straylight]

So I am you and what I see is me?

Ideally, yeah.

Humans are gods unto themselves unfortunately ;)

[Zarathustra]

Ideally, yeah.

Humans are gods unto themselves unfortunately ;)

Yet there still exists something external to us, which is our judge?

[sylvius]

Yet there still exists something external to us, which is our judge?

'something' that can go through walls?

Or is it a person?

John 20: 19

On the evening of that first day of the week, when the doors were locked, where the disciples were, for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood in their midst and said to them, "Peace be with you."


v.26-27:

Now a week later his disciples were again inside and Thomas was with them. Jesus came, although the doors were locked, and stood in their midst and said, "Peace be with you."
Then he said to Thomas, "Put your finger here and see my hands, and bring your hand and put it into my side, and do not be unbelieving, but believe."

[Zarathustra]

'something' that can go through walls?

Or is it a person?

Either way, it is a thing that is external to me. So God would be classed as a thing. In this case a person thing. In the other case, anything that is eternal thing.
The problem I raised with straylight is that if God was everything, then God would be judging God by judging anything. God is inherently perfect, so God judges perfection. Only one result could come from this.

[Straylight]

Yet there still exists something external to us, which is our judge?

Again, there's a confusion of terms between us. What is meant by "external"? As far as I'm concerned at least, there's a difference between something being "external" and something being "transcendent". Being "external" just entails being another element to an equation. Many things are external from us -- Other people, for instance; or cats, dogs, trees, ants, stars, galaxies, chairs, apples, etc..

Transcendency is another category. The concept of "rights" could be transcendent, for example...

However, if you're a person who shapes his worldview by internal will (and I fear that you might, seeing that you have a Nietzsche quote in your sig ;) ), then you probably won't care much for the idea of transcendancy, let alone God. I wouldn't know how to speak of the nature of God to someone who may not accept the idea of transcendency to begin with.