Does Jesus need to fix his clock?

[Homie]

Paul and and many of the apostles believe that the endtimes would come before they die, and with good reason, these are Jesus's words:

Mar 9:1 And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.

Mar 13:28 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When her branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is near:
Mar 13:29 So ye in like manner, when ye shall see these things come to pass, know that it is nigh, even at the doors.
Mar 13:30 Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.
Mar 13:31 Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.
Mar 13:32 But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.
Mar 13:33 Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is.

Rev 22:20 He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.


????? Was Jesus mistaken?

[Thomas2003]

No, He was not mistaken. The Kingdom of God came into power during that generation, that is to say it annexed all nations under His mediatorial rule as King and High Priest. (Matthew 28:18)

Peter, using Virgil's expression in regards to Caesar, explains it in Acts 4:12

"Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved."

The divine ephiphany is the battle of the ages, who is the King of the Mountain; man or God?

Jesus Christ declared it on the cross...."it is finished."

Cordially,

Thomas

[Dee Dee Warren]

The "endtimes" properly defined did come in the first century, Left Behing notwithstanding.

[Homie]

Today @ 07:35 PM post located here
Dee Dee Warren:

The "endtimes" properly defined did come in the first century, Left Behing notwithstanding.

???

What about "I come quickly"?
And in Mark 13:28-33, what time was he talking about?

THOMAS
The divine ephiphany is the battle of the ages, who is the King of the Mountain; man or God?

HOMIE
That needs further explanation, thank you.
Are you saying that "Gods kingdom coming with power" is the death on the cross?

[Suede]

Homie,

+++What about "I come quickly"?
And in Mark 13:28-33, what time was he talking about?+++

Well I think you just found out why Futurism doesn't have a leg to stand on. As far as I come quickly, it will depend on which Preterist view you choose. If Partial, then the I come quickly refers to Christ's coming to judge Israel. If Full, then I come quickly means to judge Israel, judge mankind, the Resurrections, and dwell with man forever.

As far as Mark 13 goes, it's the same thing. Jesus is talking about coming soon, but it's now a matter of what He did at that coming. Again, only Preterism can answer this and it depends of which view you choose, either full or partial.

SUEDE

[Dee Dee Warren]

And of course I unhesitatingly say that "full" preterism is no option as it denies an essential of the historic Christian faith.

[FirstSunday33ad]

Mar 9:1 And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.

And with the exception of Judas all of those with Jesus when He said this were alive when He was resurrected – that is when the kingdom of God came with power.

Mar 13:28 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When her branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is near:
Mar 13:29 So ye in like manner, when ye shall see these things come to pass, know that it is nigh, even at the doors.
Mar 13:30 Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.
Mar 13:31 Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.
Mar 13:32 But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.
Mar 13:33 Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is.

The generation that Jesus was speaking about was still going when about 39 years later the Romans took Jerusalem and destroyed the Temple.

As to the “come quickly” statements, I am not well versed enough to answer that one as of yet. But I hope the other two helped.

(NT Wright has a good examination of these questions in "Jesus and the Victory of God, that might help).

[RevSteve45]

Homie,

It is only partially correct to say that the Kingdom of God "annexed all nations under His mediatorial rule as King and High Priest. " The Gospel of the Kingdom of God was preached throughout the Roman Empire, to be sure, by the end of the First Century. However, there were hundreds of millions of people in OTHER parts of the world, who would not hear the Gospel for hundreds, or even thousands of years.

I believe when Jesus spoke about "this generation," He was speaking about those people who would live in the Dispensation of Grace. All the same, it is clear that First-Century Christians believed that Christ would come again either in their lifetimes, or shortly afterwards.

As a Pre-Tribulationist, I believe that the Tribulation, Millenium & New Heavens & New Earth, will ALL be in the future. The end-times may have BEGUN in the First Century, however they have lasted nearly 2,000 years SINCE then. I see no evidence that Jesus Christ is ruling the nations with a rod of iron, either secretly or otherwise. Satan is certainly not in the Bottomless Pit, either, but is as active as he ever was.

In His Service,
Steve

[Marcus1962]

These verses are in reference to verses 1-27.

Mark 13:1 As He was going out of the temple, one of His disciples said to Him, "Teacher, behold what wonderful stones and what wonderful buildings!" 2 And Jesus said to him, "Do you see these great buildings? Not one stone will be left upon another which will not be torn down." 3 As He was sitting on the Mount of Olives opposite the temple, Peter and James and John and Andrew were questioning Him privately, 4 "Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign when all these things are going to be fulfilled?" 5 And Jesus began to say to them, "See to it that no one misleads you. 6 "Many will come in My name, saying, "I am He!' and will mislead many. 7 "When you hear of wars and rumors of wars, do not be frightened; those things must take place; but that is not yet the end. 8 "For nation will rise up against nation, and kingdom against kingdom; there will be earthquakes in various places; there will also be famines. These things are merely the beginning of birth pangs. 9 "But be on your guard; for they will deliver you to the courts, and you will be flogged in the synagogues, and you will stand before governors and kings for My sake, as a testimony to them. 10 "The gospel must first be preached to all the nations. 11 "When they arrest you and hand you over, do not worry beforehand about what you are to say, but say whatever is given you in that hour; for it is not you who speak, but it is the Holy Spirit. 12 "Brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; and children will rise up against parents and have them put to death. 13 "You will be hated by all because of My name, but the one who endures to the end, he will be saved. 14 "But when you see the ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION standing where it should not be (let the reader understand), then those who are in Judea must flee to the mountains. 15 "The one who is on the housetop must not go down, or go in to get anything out of his house; 16 and the one who is in the field must not turn back to get his coat. 17 "But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! 18 "But pray that it may not happen in the winter. 19 "For those days will be a time of tribulation such as has not occurred since the beginning of the creation which God created until now, and never will. 20 "Unless the Lord had shortened those days, no life would have been saved; but for the sake of the elect, whom He chose, He shortened the days. 21 "And then if anyone says to you, "Behold, here is the Christ'; or, "Behold, He is there'; do not believe him; 22 for false Christs and false prophets will arise, and will show signs and wonders, in order to lead astray, if possible, the elect. 23 "But take heed; behold, I have told you everything in advance. 24 "But in those days, after that tribulation, THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT, 25 AND THE STARS WILL BE FALLING from heaven, and the powers that are in the heavens will be shaken. 26 "Then they will see THE SON OF MAN COMING IN CLOUDS with great power and glory. 27 "And then He will send forth the angels, and will gather together His elect from the four winds, from the farthest end of the earth to the farthest end of heaven. NASU

Many of the signs have yet to occur. We haven't had an explosion yet of false messiahs using signs and wonders. The extreme celestial events of verses 25 and 26 have yet to occur. Not to mention the heavenly events of 26 and 27. The generation that wouldn't pass away will be the one that witnesses the events of verses 24 through 27.

[The Laughing Man]

Didn't this subject come up a month ago? And again a month before that? Okay, maybe not that frequently, but it comes up often enough. Perhaps we should have a section for the most popular skeptic objections.

[Homie]

I see your point Jinx72, but we cannor all be online all the time. Every skeptic question has probably been posted before, but that dosn't mean that I have read every question and its answear. Just trying to understand

MARCUS1962
The generation that wouldn't pass away will be the one that witnesses the events of verses 24 through 27.

HOMIE
That could be the answear. Knowing greek well would be helpful in understanding what Jesus is really saying in this context, I think. Also, I think your theory is not likely because verses 24-26 is not signs pointing to the 2nd coming but rather the description of the 2nd coming. And what about the "I come quickly" - statement from Jesus? Was he making a joke, being ironic? From the context it doesn't seem so.

Putting Mark 9:1 in context it seems that Jesus is talking about his 2nd coming, not his resurrection:

Mar 8:38 Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.
Mar 9:1 And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.

If Jesus was pointing to the starting of the end times that would click well with me (which most likely is the destruction of the temple at ca. 70 AD) but the sum of these scriptures tells me that Jesus said he would be back in a jiffy, which he wasn't!

But Jinx72 indicated that he had encountered this question several times, so maybe he could give me an answear

BTW, thanks a lot for trying guys, it is good that we can turn to each other for guidance about scripture.

Note: For further replies, please do not refer to views (such as futurism and preterism), because I do not know about them, a simple logical explanation would suffice, thank you.

God bless