Proving the existence of God

[adavila]

I might have a discussion with an atheist next week from where i work and i wanted to know some extra tips on debating for the existence of God..

[Carpedm9587]

I might have a discussion with an atheist next week from where i work and i wanted to know some extra tips on debating for the existence of God..

Don't

[Nick Hallandale]

I might have a discussion with an atheist next week from where i work and i wanted to know some extra tips on debating for the existence of God..

I think that you will be wasting your time. These debates always end up in a tie. You can't prove God exists and he can't prove God doesn't exist.

[norwegen]

Bring two shovels.

[Carpedm9587]

Bring two shovels.

For all of the waste product that will be flying around?

[Carpedm9587]

I think that you will be wasting your time. These debates always end up in a tie. You can't prove God exists and he can't prove God doesn't exist.

Spoilsport!

Seriously - even if there is no "proof" possible - a debate can be a good way to articulate views and test them.

And the winner of the debate doesn't have to be right - just more convincing!

[NeilUnreal]

"What is the matter with him? Don't they have oranges where he comes from?"

-Rinpoche

[adavila]

Well i'm not really trying to win a debate anything, I just want to make sure i'm clear in what i'm saying..I know that the person ultimately will make up his mind as to whether or not he wants to believe in a God.

[Carpedm9587]

Well i'm not really trying to win a debate anything, I just want to make sure i'm clear in what i'm saying..I know that the person ultimately will make up his mind as to whether or not he wants to believe in a God.

Adavila, I can't speak for all atheists and I dont know about your pending competitor. I can tell you that I don't find "belief in god" to be something for which "wanting" has any relevance. What I WANT doesn't change what IS. I am not an atheist because I want to be; I am an atheist because I want to believe what is true and what I have found to be true is that there is no god.

If someday I find that to be an incorrect belief - and I discover there IS a god - then I will believe that.

You'd be better advised to focus on demonstrating why you believe it is true that there is a god and assume your opponent is likewise pursuing what he/she finds to be true in good faith.

Just a thought -

Michel

[Philosophickle]

I might have a discussion with an atheist next week from where i work and i wanted to know some extra tips on debating for the existence of God..

Always remember to keep it civil. Christianity, at its heart, is about love (assuming you are a Christian). Even if you articulated an undefeatable proof, your attitude and general demeanor will speak volumes more than any deductive syllogism. I like to pretend that I'm disagreeing with my Grandmother. It tends to keep me humble, and I spend more time trying to understand their position.

[FlimFlamboyant]

Always remember to keep it civil. Christianity, at its heart, is about love (assuming you are a Christian). Even if you articulated an undefeatable proof, your attitude and general demeanor will speak volumes more than any deductive syllogism.

I have to agree 100% with that. You know, this person has already looked at the most outstanding evidence of God's existance there is (the creation) and chalked it up to some freak accident. What could we possibly add that would be any more profound than that? I certainly can't think of anything unless it's what Philosophickle just mentioned; essentially, manifesting the love of Christ. It's better to just let your example and the scriptures speak for themselves. Beyond that, it's up to him (or her). If you're looking for that "killer argument", I think you'll be searching in vain for a long, long time.

[salvationfound]

One trap that may come about that you need to watch out for is the idea
that if you fail the other person's position wins by default.

Basically the other debator may claim that all he has to do to win is rip apart
all your arguments and then he is the clear winner. They probably won't
bring arguments against the existence of God which is fine and you shouldn't
stress that point. If they do bring up arguments then great do your best but
don't be expecting it. If you stress that point then you come into the risk
of arguing between is atheism "belief that God doesn't exist" or "lack of belief
in God" which can go on forever.

Mainly stress out the point that the existence of God doesn't hinge on
whether your arguments are powerful enough. You can have the worst
arguments but it doesn't prove that God doesn't exist it would just mean that
you personally failed to make convincing arguments.

[Carpedm9587]

One trap that may come about that you need to watch out for is the idea
that if you fail the other person's position wins by default.

Basically the other debator may claim that all he has to do to win is rip apart
all your arguments and then he is the clear winner. They probably won't
bring arguments against the existence of God which is fine and you shouldn't
stress that point. If they do bring up arguments then great do your best but
don't be expecting it. If you stress that point then you come into the risk
of arguing between is atheism "belief that God doesn't exist" or "lack of belief
in God" which can go on forever.

Mainly stress out the point that the existence of God doesn't hinge on
whether your arguments are powerful enough. You can have the worst
arguments but it doesn't prove that God doesn't exist it would just mean that
you personally failed to make convincing arguments.

Actually - in the world of debates - if you obviously fail then the other person might actually win by default. Debates aren't about truth - they are about convincing. The winner of the debate is the one that most impresses the audience/judges.

Michel

[bigsplit]

Well i'm not really trying to win a debate anything, I just want to make sure i'm clear in what i'm saying..I know that the person ultimately will make up his mind as to whether or not he wants to believe in a God.

Just remember to be prepared to answer what I think of as the big three.

1) Where did God come from?

2) Why is there evil?

3) Why does God not reveal himself definitively?

You have to know these questions will arise and be prepared to answer them. Also, remember you are arguing for the existance of God or not and avoid utilizing your specific belief system, (ie Christianity, Muslim, Jewish..etc.) You want to approach it philosophically and rationally.

[zorathruster]

I might have a discussion with an atheist next week from where i work and i wanted to know some extra tips on debating for the existence of God..

Use "feelings", like "I feel much better because I believe in God". There is no counter to this level of debate. Your feelings cannot be debated by the opponent, since you have them and he doesn't. Note also that many believers do good things which is obvious and factual. Actual works that can be identified. Now you have established "good" causation and factual "good" events. If he is an unskilled debater he will be unable to counter the assertion and you can claim victory.