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Thread: The Antichrist

  1. #11
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by eschaton View Post
    Jud 1:6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.


    2Pe 2:4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;
    These are the two verses that correlate with the Book of Enoch that also describes the angels being bound in "darkness" and held until the "great judgement." So either Peter and Jude directly cited the Book of Enoch (more than likely since we know that source existed in their time and Jude cites a direct word for word quote about the coming of the Lord) or cited a common Enoch source about the angels that both they and the Book of Enoch used.

  2. #12
    tWebber eschaton's Avatar
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    Mat 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

    This one mentions everlasting fire and angels as well as devils. As far as allusions to Enoch there might be a hundred in the NT. Check Godawa's videos.

    https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...QsWYRR293OgMPz
    Last edited by eschaton; 08-02-2015 at 05:31 AM. Reason: more info.

  3. #13
    tWebber
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    Point being that the oldest tradition supports the belief that the benei haelohim of Genesis 6 were angels, even by inspired apostles.

  4. #14
    tWebber eschaton's Avatar
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    Yes that's right.

    But I'm interested in showing that I Enoch is worthy of study. Godawa gives well over 30 similarities to the NT, but there are a lot more similarities than that, like the seven mountains and a lot of imagery in Revelation and some in Daniel as well. The book of Jubilees has a lot of similar info. If interested in the Antichrist the Ascension of Isaiah has some good info that shows the connection to Belial/Beliar. It dates back to the first century and is one of the books the Jews were trying to delete according to Justin Martyr.

  5. #15
    tWebber
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    I find it interesting too, but I believe the prevalent argument among many scholars is that it was heavily redacted during the early Christian era, probably because it wasn't considered on par with other works of the canon as far as its authenticity.

  6. #16
    tWebber Rushing Jaws's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darfius View Post
    According to tradition, part of the means God used to stop Nimrod's rebellion was to send Shem son of Noah to kill him. But whatever the reason, the worship of the dragon went underground at this point and became known as the "mysteries", passed on only to the "initiated" who could be trusted or intimidated into keeping it secret. The mystery religion passed on from the Canaanites to the Egyptians to the Assyrians to the Babylonians to the Greeks to the Romans to the Gnostics to the Masons.
    ## With the exception of part of the last sentence, that sounds suspiciously as though it is based on A. Hislop's "The Two Babylons", which began as a pamphlet, and became a book in 1858. It is a mass of ingenious fiction, intended as (in effect) a "brief for the prosecution" against the CC. Hislop in turn appears to have been influenced by a series of very readable but richly fictional essays by one H. J. Jones in the 1852 & 1853 numbers of "The Quarterly Journal of Prophecy". Jones's 100 or so pages are almost entirely without footnotes, so his statements are impossible to check - Hislop, whatever criticisms can be made of his book, does at least give 1,027 footnotes. (I take the number from the German translation of TTB, which replaces the daggers, obeloi and asterisks of TTB's notes by numbers in sequence.)

    Hislop's account of the "rise and progress" of the "Babylonian Mystery Religion" is dressed up in the garb of tradition, in that ancient authors are quoted or cited or otherwise used for various details of this or that - but the substance of the account, and the inter-relation of the data relied on, is not ancient, but is of Hislop's confecting, with several dollops of help from Jones.

    Hislop's order of BMR-receiving peoples is:

    Nimrod & Semiramis (& Tammuz, who is alleged to be a re-incarnated Nimrod) (c. 2182/1 BC)
    Egyptians
    Greeks
    Attalus III of Pergamum (before 133 BC)
    Romans (45 BC for some aspects of the alleged BMR)
    Church in Rome

    And to a large number of other cultures, without indication of when or how, including (in no particular order):
    Cyprus
    American Indians
    Druids
    Scotland
    Tahiti
    India
    Siam
    Japan
    Tibet
    China
    Anglo-Saxon England
    France
    Etruria

    Those are the ones I can remember off-hand. There are probably others. I don't recall any mention of the Gnostics or Masons in TTB; or of the Canaanites.

    1 Timothy 4.7 seems appropriate: "But have nothing to do with worldly fables fit only for old women. On the other hand, discipline yourself for the purpose of godliness..." Nimrod is the Big Bad of the Story - Semiramis doubles as Evil Chancellor, & Dragon to Nimrod's Big Bad.

  7. #17
    tWebber
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    Nice try, papist. The Masons themselves trace their descent from Egypt, and their secrets aren't about how to bake a good pie. I know your first pope was Simon Magus.

  8. #18
    Professor Catholicity's Avatar
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    What The Letters of St. John say about the Anti Christ.
    Quote Originally Posted by 1 John 2:21-22
    …18Children, it is the last hour; and just as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, so now many antichrists have appeared. This is how we know it is the last hour. 19They went out from us, but they did not belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us. But their departure made it clear that none of them belonged to us. 20You, however, have an anointing from the Holy One, and all of you know the truth.…21I have not written you because you lack knowledge of the truth, but because you have it, and because no lie comes from the truth. 22Who is the liar, if it is not the one who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, who denies the Father and the Son.
    That will do. Answered
    A happy family is but an earlier heaven.
    George Bernard Shaw

  9. Amen Rushing Jaws amen'd this post.
  10. #19
    Must...have...caffeine One Bad Pig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darfius View Post
    I know your first pope was Simon Magus.
    Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

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  11. #20
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Catholicity View Post
    What The Letters of St. John say about the Anti Christ.
    That will do. Answered
    Problem is, it's not an answer. Was he affirming or denying a future "antichrist"? It isn't clear. Which character in Revelation is he speaking of? It isn't clear. Was he even speaking in association with anyone described in Rev? It isn't clear.

    That passage can be interpreted as: "Yes, there is a future antichrist coming, but there are also antichrists among us now" (Paul confirms at least the spirit of lawlessness was among them). Or: "what are you guys talking about a future antichrist; they're already here among us now."

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