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Canada: The Uniting Church in Crises

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  • Canada: The Uniting Church in Crises

    In today's press I came across an article which outlined a crises for the United Church of Canada. They have an ordained minister who openly dismisses belief in God, the Bible & Jesus. Their admin wants to defrock her but they haven't done so before so apparently they are in a flux as to how to go about getting rid of her...

    Most strange...

    Have a read. Enjoy...

  • #2



    GiantBabyEarClean-e1374459138645.jpg
    1Cor 15:34 Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
    .
    ⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛
    Scripture before Tradition:
    but that won't prevent others from
    taking it upon themselves to deprive you
    of the right to call yourself Christian.

    ⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛

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    • #3
      Originally posted by tabibito View Post



      [ATTACH=CONFIG]8585[/ATTACH]
      The ⅔ who had serious objections already left and aren't part of the congregation. The rest likely come for the socializing and very possibly pay little attention to what is being preached or aren't actually concerned about the sermons (Hey, they're serving coffee cake and beverages after the service and that potential business contact will be there)

      I'm always still in trouble again

      "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
      "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
      "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

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      • #4
        "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

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        • #5
          Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
          The ⅔ who had serious objections already left and aren't part of the congregation. The rest likely come for the socializing and very possibly pay little attention to what is being preached or aren't actually concerned about the sermons (Hey, they're serving coffee cake and beverages after the service and that potential business contact will be there)
          Ah yes - the current congregation airs no complaints (there are no complaints) - but given that Mr Bowes was on the selection committee, "has had no complaints" is not quite accurate.
          1Cor 15:34 Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
          .
          ⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛
          Scripture before Tradition:
          but that won't prevent others from
          taking it upon themselves to deprive you
          of the right to call yourself Christian.

          ⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛

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          • #6
            The United Church in Canada has been heretical for years now. This is nothing new.


            Securely anchored to the Rock amid every storm of trial, testing or tribulation.

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            • #7
              Yep, the United Church of Canada doesn't really care about doctrine, but rather appeasing to what the world wants.
              "It's evolution; every time you invent something fool-proof, the world invents a better fool."
              -Unknown

              "Preach the gospel, and if necessary use words." - Most likely St.Francis


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              • #8
                I read some of the comments (in another article about the same topic) and one of the most common responses is that church is about "teaching good morals" so who cares what she believes.

                Let me sound off a resounding no!!!

                This sort of mentality is so completely missing the point as to border on comical (well, comical if it wasn't so tragic that people actually think this). While morals and doing good works are important they aren't the foundation of the Christian faith nor are they really the focus.

                Let me shout this out--it is all about Jesus.Christianity is based on the death and resurrection of Jesus without which our faith is in vain and we are beyond pathetic (to paraphrase Paul).

                Trying to make a Christian church not all about Jesus is a hideous insult that infuriates me. It also confuses me greatly as I really don't understand why an atheist would want to be a Christian minister. I understand, as Irate Canadian pointed out, that the United Church doesn't care about doctrine, but this just seems unbelievable. There shouldn't be any discussion about this, if they are claiming to be part of the global Church she should be kicked out pronto. If they want to instead claim to be some kind of humanistic organization than they need to disavow themselves from Christianity immediately. It is like false advertisement--a Christian looking to get fellowship may wander in as they might mistaken it for an actual church and then be disgusted to realize that it isn't.
                Last edited by Paula; 08-06-2015, 10:04 PM.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Paula View Post
                  I read some of the comments (in another article about the same topic) and one of the most common responses is that church is about "teaching good morals" so who cares what she believes.

                  Let me sound off a resounding no!!!

                  This sort of mentality is so completely missing the point as to border on comical (well, comical if it wasn't so tragic that people actually think this). While morals and doing good works are important they aren't the foundation of the Christian faith nor are they really the focus.

                  Let me shout this out--it is all about Jesus.Christianity is based on the death and resurrection of Jesus without which our faith is in vain and we are beyond pathetic (to paraphrase Paul).

                  Trying to make a Christian church not all about Jesus is a hideous insult that infuriates me. It also confuses me greatly as I really don't understand why an atheist would want to be a Christian minister. I understand, as Irate Canadian pointed out, that the United Church doesn't care about doctrine, but this just seems unbelievable. There shouldn't be any discussion about this, if they are claiming to be part of the global Church she should be kicked out pronto. If they want to instead claim to be some kind of humanistic organization than they need to disavow themselves from Christianity immediately. It is like false advertisement--a Christian looking to get fellowship may wander in as they might mistaken it for an actual church and then be disgusted to realize that it isn't.
                  This morning as I was wading through the business news I came across an article about Australia's strict labeling laws (truth in labeling and advertising) and the problems niche, high-end producers have had with counterfeiting, especially in China - protecting one's "Brand" is essential in the current international markets...and that requires ensuring the quality and safety of what the customer takes home...

                  Whats all that got to do with the United Church in Canada's current dilemma. Everything!!! Think about it...

                  Originally posted by Paula View Post
                  It also confuses me greatly as I really don't understand why an atheist would want to be a Christian minister.
                  A benevolent mentality (Jesus did advocate such, and it is something missing in many churches and so societies). That is the positive, additionally...

                  Funding!!!! In place infrastructure. In place marketing you can draw on to get bums on seats. Drawing on the naivety of people who are attracted to an established "brand" etc etc etc

                  An episode of "Yes Prime Minster" (a British TV comedy series seen around the world) detailed the Prime Minister's dilemma in choosing a new Archbishop of Canterbury. The problem: none of the proposed candidates promoted Christianity...

                  Originally posted by Paula View Post
                  There shouldn't be any discussion about this, if they are claiming to be part of the global Church she should be kicked out pronto. If they want to instead claim to be some kind of humanistic organization than they need to disavow themselves from Christianity immediately.
                  Apart from Church law and internal administration, the UCC will have to deal with Civil law - unlawful dismissal, the supporting congregations property rights, accounting, funding and so on... Civilly it is a really complicated situation to rectify...
                  Last edited by apostoli; 08-07-2015, 06:15 PM.

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                  • #10
                    UPDATE....she keeps her job...

                    https://pulpitandpen.org/2018/11/10/...ill-keeps-job/
                    Watch your links! http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/fa...corumetiquette

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by DesertBerean View Post
                      Not surprising. It's so sad. My Dad became a believer while attending the United church. How far it has fallen.

                      And, tragically, the "social gospel" minded evangelical churches today are headed in the same direction.


                      Securely anchored to the Rock amid every storm of trial, testing or tribulation.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by DesertBerean View Post
                        I forgot about this thread when I nominated it for a screwball:

                        Originally posted by rogue06
                        Screwball

                        Source: Opinion split after atheist minister keeps job

                        Source

                        © Copyright Original Source



                        This should have been a no-brainer. Then what can you expect from a denomination that essentially thinks that other non-Christian religions are just as valid a way to finding God as Christianity.

                        I'm always still in trouble again

                        "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                        "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                        "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

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                        • #13
                          I looked up the United Church beliefs and I bet they found they were hoisted by their own petard. To kick her out, by their own standards, was hypocritcal (if heretical).

                          We've had our church constitution written very narrowly to avoid this liability.
                          Watch your links! http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/fa...corumetiquette

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