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Overwhelming Support for our Police

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  • Overwhelming Support for our Police

    Our city Police Chief and our County Sheriff are working together with our area ministerial alliance to prepare our community for possible unrest relating to officer involved shootings.

    As I mentioned elsewhere, my son-in-law is a shift commander on the same police department for which I serve as Chaplain. When a local jailer was tried for beating up a black inmate, Quanell X (sp?) and the New Black Panther Party were in town with the implication that riots would break out if the jury didn't convict.

    Our Sheriff's Department, along with NUMEROUS DPS and Texas Rangers kinda "surrounded" the agitators, but not in a provocative manner at all. It appeared that they had instructions to be relaxed, because they (the contingent of law enforcement) were friendly, even jovial, and "projected calm". X and the NBPP folks looked a bit out of sorts - I think they're used to less friendly treatment.

    Anyway, we have had a series of incidents at night where officers stop a car for speeding, and it's a young black male (not the same one each time) who taunts the officer, apparently trying to get him mad. One of them (thank God for Body Cams) was screaming at my son-in-law "Aren't you going to SHOOT ME"?

    One of the things we're doing is building up a video library of these incidents, and sharing them with church congregations, civic groups, clubs... they'll probably even be shown in our schools - that's still under discussion.

    The idea is to prepare the community that our guys are being VERY restrained, but IF a situation happened where there was an officer involved shooting, it needs to be seen in the overall context of this apparent "probing" action. Some of the officers who were adamantly opposed to the body cams now endorse them whole-heartedly because of some of the idiocy they were able to catch on video.

    I sure hope it never comes to it, but if there's "trouble in paradise", we're hoping that overwhelming support for our officers offsets the trouble that some activists may wish to visit on us. (There had been several incidents in an adjacent county because rumors were that a young black woman had been killed by cops, then kept in the county jail for several days, even though in-jail video showed her walking around and talking to deputies before she committed suicide in her jail cell)

    It's a tough world in which to be a cop. I was one many years ago -- don't think I'd want to do that today, even if I was young again.
    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

  • #2
    Body cams should be made mandatory I believe. It keeps both parties honest. If more of these types of videos come out showing the police acting properly when shooting a suspect, there will be less ammo for those agitating for violence or trying to blackmail communities into giving them verdicts they like.
    "Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." ― C.S. Lewis, God in the Dock: Essays on Theology (Making of Modern Theology)

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Jesse View Post
      Body cams should be made mandatory I believe. It keeps both parties honest. If more of these types of videos come out showing the police acting properly when shooting a suspect, there will be less ammo for those agitating for violence or trying to blackmail communities into giving them verdicts they like.
      Body cams will prove to be extremely useful but they don't come cheap.

      I'm always still in trouble again

      "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
      "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
      "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Jesse View Post
        Body cams should be made mandatory I believe. It keeps both parties honest. If more of these types of videos come out showing the police acting properly when shooting a suspect, there will be less ammo for those agitating for violence or trying to blackmail communities into giving them verdicts they like.
        Two years ago, I may have argued. Now I think they pretty much need to be standard equipment. If I were a cop today, I'd want one even if I had to buy it myself.
        The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
          Body cams will prove to be extremely useful but they don't come cheap.
          And I think it's good that they'll help weed out the "bad cops" as well.
          The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
            Body cams will prove to be extremely useful but they don't come cheap.
            Indeed they are not. The states should take the money they use for "quotas" (Oregon has a problem with this) and make this happen. If the state really doesn't have the money, I would gladly pay more in taxes to make it happen. But I am only speaking for myself.
            "Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." ― C.S. Lewis, God in the Dock: Essays on Theology (Making of Modern Theology)

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            • #7
              What about the issue of Gun violence in the US? How does a cop tell the difference between a good guy with a gun and a bad guy with a gun in the few seconds they have to decided? Should officer come out and address gun violence?

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                And I think it's good that they'll help weed out the "bad cops" as well.
                Just like dash cams and cameras in the booking areas of police stations. While they have indeed exposed cases of police misconduct (sometimes severe), far more often they've proved invaluable when a defense attorney comes in fuming over police brutality. The police sit the lawyer down to watch what the cameras caught and the usual result is a suddenly contrite lawyer asking about plea bargain arrangements.

                I'm always still in trouble again

                "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                  Just like dash cams and cameras in the booking areas of police stations. While they have indeed exposed cases of police misconduct, far more often they've proved invaluable when a defense attorney comes in fuming over police brutality. The police sit the lawyer down to watch what the cameras caught and the usual result is a suddenly contrite lawyer asking about plea bargain arrangements.
                  I've told this story before -- where I had to arrest a city councilwoman for public intox, and she sued me and the department for abusing her. At the pre-trial hearing, our city attorney played the video of the booking room where she was shouting the F word and threatening to have our badges, and whip our !$@#!^ and blow up the police station, etc.....

                  About 30 seconds into the video, HER attorney walked over to the VCR and pushed "stop", and said "I think we're done here".
                  The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by AlecWelsh View Post
                    What about the issue of Gun violence in the US? How does a cop tell the difference between a good guy with a gun and a bad guy with a gun in the few seconds they have to decided? Should officer come out and address gun violence?
                    No one in their right mind would flash a gun near a police officer. Unless you plan on committing suicide.
                    "Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." ― C.S. Lewis, God in the Dock: Essays on Theology (Making of Modern Theology)

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Jesse View Post
                      No one in their right mind would flash a gun near a police officer. Unless you plan on committing suicide.
                      So you do not think there is a problem regarding gun violence that makes a police officers job harder?

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by AlecWelsh View Post
                        So you do not think there is a problem regarding gun violence that makes a police officers job harder?
                        I am not real sure what you mean. Any weapon would make a police officers job harder. You would be dumb to flash any weapon in the presence of the police.
                        "Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." ― C.S. Lewis, God in the Dock: Essays on Theology (Making of Modern Theology)

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Jesse View Post
                          I am not real sure what you mean. Any weapon would make a police officers job harder. You would be dumb to flash any weapon in the presence of the police.
                          That is my point. Just because someone has a weapon does not give the officer any rights in this country since nearly anyone has a right to guns. just because someone flashes a weapon doesn't mean anything. Like my original question, how is an officer suppose to tell the difference between a good guy with a gun and a bad guy with a gun? You have people walking in public with rifles just to show they can. And until the moment the go shooting people you have no way to know if they are going to.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by AlecWelsh View Post
                            That is my point. Just because someone has a weapon does not give the officer any rights in this country since nearly anyone has a right to guns. just because someone flashes a weapon doesn't mean anything.
                            Actually, most municipalities and jurisdictions have some variation of the "brandishing a weapon" provision. It is illegal.

                            Like my original question, how is an officer suppose to tell the difference between a good guy with a gun and a bad guy with a gun?
                            A good guy doesn't brandish a weapon in the presence of an officer - only a criminal or an idiot would do that. THAT, sometimes, is hard to discern.

                            You have people walking in public with rifles just to show they can.
                            And in places where that's legal (which isn't a lot of places) there are clear restrictions on how they are to be handled.

                            And until the moment the go shooting people you have no way to know if they are going to.
                            There are clear rules of engagement for using deadly force. An officer who uses deadly force will be required to demonstrate that he followed those rules.

                            Next?
                            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Jesse View Post
                              I am not real sure what you mean. Any weapon would make a police officers job harder. You would be dumb to flash any weapon in the presence of the police.
                              Yup! A certain Twebber once wrote that he was flailing some foam nunchucks around, and complained bitterly that the police "harassed" him for it. After all, they were only foam! Only an idiot would do that, or even aim a toy gun at police. A police officer is allowed to respond with deadly force when he believes his life (or the life of another) is in immediate bodily danger, etc. (Some departments will define what that danger consists of)
                              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

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