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This forum is a debate area to discuss issues pertaining to the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society (the Jehovah's Witnesses). This forum is generally for theists only, and is not the area for debate between atheists and theists. Non-theist may not post here without first obtaining permission from the moderator of this forum. Granting of such permission is subject to Moderator discretion - and may be revoked if the Moderator feels that the poster is not keeping with the spirit of the World Regligions Department.


Atheists are welcome to discuss and debate these issues in the Apologetics 301 forum without such restrictions.

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  • #16
    The JWs think that Jesus is the Arch-Angel Michael who came down and became a man.

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by Sparko View Post
      The JWs think that Jesus is the Arch-Angel Michael who came down and became a man.
      In the 1800's there were Trinitarian Christians who actually thought the Arc-Angel Michael {Michael meaning "Who is like God"} was an identity of the Son of God.

      ". . . But Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing judgment, but said, The Lord rebuke thee. . . ." -- Jude 9.

      ". . . And he showed me Joshua the high priest standing before the angel of Jehovah, and Satan standing at his right hand to be his adversary. And Jehovah said unto Satan, Jehovah rebuke thee, . . ." -- Zachariah 3:1-2.

      ". . . For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven, with a shout, with the voice of the archangel . . ." -- 1 Thessalonians 4:16.
      . . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV

      . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV

      Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by 37818 View Post

        ". . . For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven, with a shout, with the voice of the archangel . . ." -- 1 Thessalonians 4:16.

        Which "Lord" as there are many?
        BU

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Jedidiah View Post
          No as God's Kingdom is in heaven, read Matthew:-
          1 Corinthians 15:50
          But I tell you this, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit God’s Kingdom. . .

          So to go into "God's Kingdom" one has to be in spirit form!
          BU

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by Bibleuser View Post
            No as God's Kingdom is in heaven, read Matthew:-
            1 Corinthians 15:50
            But I tell you this, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit God’s Kingdom. . .

            So to go into "God's Kingdom" one has to be in spirit form!
            BU


            Luk 17:21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.
            That's what
            - She

            Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
            - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

            I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
            - Stephen R. Donaldson

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Bibleuser View Post
              Which "Lord" as there are many?
              BU
              To humans, yes. We humans find many people and things that we allow to be our lord. But there is only one Lord - Jesus Christ.
              That's what
              - She

              Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
              - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

              I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
              - Stephen R. Donaldson

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Bibleuser View Post
                No as God's Kingdom is in heaven, read Matthew:-
                1 Corinthians 15:50
                But I tell you this, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit God’s Kingdom. . .

                So to go into "God's Kingdom" one has to be in spirit form!
                BU
                Huh? Jesus is a man right now at the right hand of God so to speak, ". . . For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; . . ." -- 1 Timothy 2:5.
                . . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV

                . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV

                Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Bibleuser View Post
                  Originally posted by 37818 View Post
                  ". . . For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven, with a shout, with the voice of the archangel . . ." -- 1 Thessalonians 4:16.
                  Which "Lord" as there are many?
                  BU
                  Who do you think Jehovah meant? Himself or the one Lord Jesus Christ? ". . . For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. . . ." -- 1 Thessalonians 4:14-17.
                  . . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV

                  . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV

                  Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post
                    To humans, yes. We humans find many people and things that we allow to be our lord. But there is only one Lord - Jesus Christ.
                    This is very True!
                    BU

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Bibleuser View Post
                      This is very True!
                      BU
                      Then your god isn't Lord because he isn't Jesus Christ.
                      That's what
                      - She

                      Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
                      - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

                      I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
                      - Stephen R. Donaldson

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post
                        Then your god isn't Lord because he isn't Jesus Christ.
                        My God is a Lord and Jesus is a Lord

                        Deuteronomy 10:17
                        For Jehovah your God is the God of gods and the Lord of lords, the God great, . . .

                        cts 2:36
                        Therefore, let all the house of Israel know for a certainty that God made him both Lord and Christ, this Jesus whom you executed on a stake.”

                        One is Lord by because of his right as creator of the cosmos and all in it, and that one appointed Jesus over all things as HIS King of kings and Lord of lords over mankind as his appointed saviour.
                        BU

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Twist and cherry pick them scriptures.
                          Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            16 For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him.

                            Notice carefully that it does not say all things "except" Christ Himself. This if it was created Christ created it. Therefore Christ was, according to scripture, not created at all regardless of how you twist the words.
                            Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Jedidiah View Post
                              Twist and cherry pick them scriptures.
                              I think you will find from Jesus and the Apostles they always use selected scripture to make any point!!
                              They were also said to twist the scriptures by non beleivers.
                              BU

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                John 1:1-3 says "though" him not by him?
                                BU

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