Celebrating Christmas

[GoBahnsen]

I wrote a blog here on Tweb a LONG time ago where I addressed this very subject. I will post it in the Rolling Pin.

Ok, I will look for it. thnx

[GoBahnsen]

I am SO glad you are here, GoBa!!

It's always fun to re-visit the old stomping grounds of theological debate where I cut my teeth and left without any. Lol. Thnx for the flowers. I will put them in a vase and tell my wife they are from The Chancellor.

[Cerebrum123]

Ok. Yeah, well sorry to disappoint, but my position is merely based on things I have picked up along the way and then simply "bought in" because it sounded legit. So, maybe I am the victim of bad info.

That's happened to me before. It's no big deal.

It does seem suspect that we are celebrating Christ's birth at a time of year when he most likely was not born in. Like requiring the subjects of Rome to travel to their own cities to file for taxes in the dead of Winter. So when I see people put out signs that Jesus is the "reason for the season"....I'm like...I don't think so. He is the reason for every season for that matter.

It looks like the reason for the December 25th date is due to an early belief about how Jesus was crucified on the day he was conceived. From there it's just a matter of adding nine months onto it to get to when He was born. Of course He is the reason for every season.

From what I can tell, there are a few early traditions that put Jesus' date of birth in Winter. I mean, not 1st Century AD early, but closer to the 200-300 A.D. range.

Christmas here in America seems to be more about family, gift giving, parties, and a bunch of fantasy stuff. Why try to shoe-horn Christ's birth in there? As if He needs or wants a birthday celebration. But if it draws one closer to Christ by celebrating His birth on December 25th, far be it from me to begrudge them that much.

Well, America, as well as much of the "West" has become increasingly secular. I think most of that other stuff was added on much more recently. Although, there does seem to be something special about the Christmas season. For some it's an increased source of stress, but for others you see an attitude change that's just not there the rest of the year.

It's a silly movie, but I think one part of the "Code of the Elves" in the movie "Elf" should actually be followed, it would lead to a lot of good. That part would be "Treat Every Day Like Christmas". Now, obviously not the message that you get from "A Charlie Brown Christmas", but I think it's still a good one. I like both movies a lot.

[Christianbookworm]

Pagans drank dihydrogen monoxide! Thus we should not drink it!

















































Of course you would then die in a few days!

[GoBahnsen]

Elf was funny!

[GoBahnsen]

Pagans drank dihydrogen monoxide! Thus we should not drink it!

















































Of course you would then die in a few days!

Pagans ate food too. Thus we should avoid food.

[Christianbookworm]

Pagans ate food too. Thus we should avoid food.

Do you get what I'm hinting at? Even if pagans did happen to use some of the same celebration activities in their holidays, it's the genetic fallacy to claim that Christians can't use Christmas decorations because pagans may have done a similar thing. Triumphant reclamation FTW!

[GoBahnsen]

Do you get what I'm hinting at? Even if pagans did happen to use some of the same celebration activities in their holidays, it's the genetic fallacy to claim that Christians can't use Christmas decorations because pagans may have done a similar thing. Triumphant reclamation FTW!

Yeah I get it. I was initially raising the issue of bringing a C tree into the local church. But I have already been shown to be without sufficient study on the subject to raise an objection.

But at some point we do have to make distinctions on various matters. I can envision 1st century pagans celebrating the solstice, as if to some sun-god or whatever the case was. And if in their celebration they did peculiar things.....it would be weird if Christians suddenly said "hey lets do that too, it looks nice." Don't you agree?

[One Bad Pig]

But at some point we do have to make distinctions on various matters. I can envision 1st century pagans celebrating the solstice, as if to some sun-god or whatever the case was. And if in their celebration they did peculiar things.....it would be weird if Christians suddenly said "hey lets do that too, it looks nice." Don't you agree?

Romans didn't celebrate the solstice in the first century. It's possible that some barbarians did, but it wasn't normative for the culture in which the church got its start.

Source: Calculating Christmas

Many Christians think that Christians celebrate Christ’s birth on December 25th because the church fathers appropriated the date of a pagan festival. Almost no one minds, except for a few groups on the fringes of American Evangelicalism, who seem to think that this makes Christmas itself a pagan festival. But it is perhaps interesting to know that the choice of December 25th is the result of attempts among the earliest Christians to figure out the date of Jesus’ birth based on calendrical calculations that had nothing to do with pagan festivals.

Rather, the pagan festival of the “Birth of the Unconquered Sun” instituted by the Roman Emperor Aurelian on 25 December 274, was almost certainly an attempt to create a pagan alternative to a date that was already of some significance to Roman Christians. Thus the “pagan origins of Christmas” is a myth without historical substance.

© Copyright Original Source

[GoBahnsen]

Romans didn't celebrate the solstice in the first century. It's possible that some barbarians did, but it wasn't normative for the culture in which the church got its start.

Source: Calculating Christmas

Many Christians think that Christians celebrate Christ’s birth on December 25th because the church fathers appropriated the date of a pagan festival. Almost no one minds, except for a few groups on the fringes of American Evangelicalism, who seem to think that this makes Christmas itself a pagan festival. But it is perhaps interesting to know that the choice of December 25th is the result of attempts among the earliest Christians to figure out the date of Jesus’ birth based on calendrical calculations that had nothing to do with pagan festivals.

Rather, the pagan festival of the “Birth of the Unconquered Sun” instituted by the Roman Emperor Aurelian on 25 December 274, was almost certainly an attempt to create a pagan alternative to a date that was already of some significance to Roman Christians. Thus the “pagan origins of Christmas” is a myth without historical substance.

© Copyright Original Source

I grew up as a believer at Calvary Chapel Costa Mesa under Chuck Smith's teaching and guest speakers there. I apologize for any bad teachings I came to believe were true.

[mossrose]

Here is a really good blog post that has really good thinking on this subject.

http://www.gty.org/Blog/B151221

[NorrinRadd]

It seems you are asking whether or not Christmas type of traditions should be included along with baptism and the Lord's Supper.

To that I would say that inside of a Church there shouldn't be a Christmas tree, etc. Only because the tree and other things that often go along with celebrating Christ's birth do have their origins in pagan traditions surrounding the Winter solstice. Of course many church leaders are ignorant of this and thus bring these pagan traditions into the house of public worship. How God feels about it, I don't know.

We have a tree in our house. My wife likes having one. It does look nice. We enjoy it thru the lens of our Christian world-view.

We should also never in church mention by name the days of the week or most of the months of the year, or the planets, because they were named to honor pagan deities.

[Cow Poke]

We should also never in church mention by name the days of the week or most of the months of the year, or the planets, because they were named to honor pagan deities.

I probably shouldn't drive my Mercury to Church, either!

[Jedidiah]

We should also never in church mention by name the days of the week or most of the months of the year, or the planets, because they were named to honor pagan deities.

I do hope this is tongue in cheek. I wish that the Christmas tree post was also.

[Christianbookworm]

I do hope this is tongue in cheek. I wish that the Christmas tree post was also.

Why wouldn't it be? Does he need to use sarcasm tags?