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Thread: 666 and RFID chips

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    tWebber
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    666 and RFID chips

    Alexander Pope wrote:

    A little learning is a dangerous thing;
    Drink deep or taste not the Pierian spring.
    There shallow draughts intoxicate the brain,
    And drinking largely sobers us again.

    (In Greek mythology the Pierian spring was a fountain which was sacred to the Muses and imparted learning to anyone who drank from it.)

    There are times when having just a little learning about what the Bible says can be a dangerous thing.


    Most people have heard of the mark of the beast and they know that it is associated with the number 666 but don’t know anything else about it. One result is that many people are afraid they will take the mark without meaning to and be eternally condemned as a result. Here are two examples.

    The first is from a news story by UPI.

    A Kentucky high school student athlete declined to participate in her team’s cross-country race after she was assigned the number 666, saying it would have gone against her religious beliefs.

    The number 666 is often associated with the biblical “mark of the beast.”

    The second is a post on a Christian forum.

    Hey guys so I’m 17 and after high school I would like to join the military (AIR FORCE!!!) but I’ve read online they might start RFIDing soldiers. I’m worried if I do enlist I will be forced to get the chip and if it turns out to be the mark of the beast…well I’m done for I guess. So can someone tell me about this? Are they really going to do this? If so is the RFID chip the actual mark of the beast? I would appreciate any help I can get guys.

    Are their fears justified? The best way to answer this question is to look at what the Bible actually says about the mark of the beast. First the beast is introduced.

    And I saw a beast rising out of the sea, with ten horns and seven heads, with ten diadems on its horns and blasphemous names on its heads. And the beast that I saw was like a leopard; its feet were like a bear’s, and its mouth was like a lion’s mouth. And to it the dragon gave his power and his throne and great authority.

    One of its heads seemed to have a mortal wound, but its mortal wound was healed, and the whole earth marveled as they followed the beast. And they worshiped the dragon, for he had given his authority to the beast, and they worshiped the beast, saying, “Who is like the beast, and who can fight against it?”
    Revelation 13:1-4 ESV

    The beast will receive power and authority from the dragon, Satan, and will become an object of worship for the whole world.

    And the beast was given a mouth uttering haughty and blasphemous words, and it was allowed to exercise authority for forty-two months. It opened its mouth to utter blasphemies against God, blaspheming his name and his dwelling, that is, those who dwell in heaven. Also it was allowed to make war on the saints and to conquer them.

    And authority was given it over every tribe and people and language and nation, and all who dwell on earth will worship it, everyone whose name has not been written before the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who was slain. If anyone has an ear, let him hear:

    If anyone is to be taken captive,
    to captivity he goes;
    if anyone is to be slain with the sword,
    with the sword must he be slain.

    Here is a call for the endurance and faith of the saints.
    Revelation 13:5-10 ESV

    Then a second beast is introduced.

    Then I saw another beast rising out of the earth. It had two horns like a lamb and it spoke like a dragon. It exercises all the authority of the first beast in its presence, and makes the earth and its inhabitants worship the first beast, whose mortal wound was healed.

    It performs great signs, even making fire come down from heaven to earth in front of people, and by the signs that it is allowed to work in the presence of the beast it deceives those who dwell on earth, telling them to make an image for the beast that was wounded by the sword and yet lived.

    And it was allowed to give breath to the image of the beast, so that the image of the beast might even speak and might cause those who would not worship the image of the beast to be slain.
    Revelation 13:11-15 ESV

    Finally everyone on the earth is required to take the mark.

    Also it causes all, both small and great, both rich and poor, both free and slave, to be marked on the right hand or the forehead, so that no one can buy or sell unless he has the mark, that is, the name of the beast or the number of its name.

    This calls for wisdom: let the one who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man, and his number is 666.
    Revelation 13:16-18 ESV

    The mark of the beast will be given at a time when the beast is ruling the earth and is already requiring that he be worshipped. An order will be issued requiring everyone to take the mark. There will be laws in effect that forbid anyone without the mark to buy or sell. None of those conditions exist today so it isn’t possible for anyone to receive the mark now.

    The number 666 will be associated in some way with the beast but now it is just a number like any other. It is simply one more than 665 and one less than 667. It might not even be the number of the beast. There are some manuscripts of Revelation that have the number 616 instead.

    It is possible that taking the mark may include implanting an RFID chip as a means of identification but if that is true the chip itself won’t be the mark; it will only be a tool used to implement it. An RFID chip is simply a device that can be used for either good or evil purposes. Perhaps the beast will use it for evil; that shouldn’t keep others from using it for good.

    Sometimes having only a little knowledge can be dangerous; the way to remove this danger is to acquire more knowledge. If you are afraid you might accidentally take the mark the best way to overcome your fear is to study Bible prophecy to learn more about what will happen in the future.

    If you want to learn more about prophecy here is a good place to start:

    https://www.raptureready.com/abc/abc.html
    The brutal, soul-shaking truth is that we are so earthly minded we are of no heavenly use.
    Leonard Ravenhill

    https://clydeherrin.wordpress.com/

  2. Amen Jedidiah amen'd this post.
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    tWebber Faber's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by theophilus View Post
    There are times when having just a little learning about what the Bible says can be a dangerous thing.
    That much I agree with.

  4. Amen Scrawly amen'd this post.
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    Theologyweb's Official Grandfather Jedidiah's Avatar
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    You can not be tricked into taking the mark. It is a matter of worship of the beast. Yes.
    Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

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    tWebber Rushing Jaws's Avatar
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    It is at least interesting - if nothing more - that the placement of the MotB appears to allude to this passage:

    Deu 6:6 “These words, which I am commanding you today, shall be on your heart.
    Deu 6:7 “You shall teach them diligently to your sons and shall talk of them when you sit in your house and when you walk by the way and when you lie down and when you rise up.
    Deu 6:8 “You shall bind them as a sign on your hand and they shall be as frontals on your forehead.

    IOW - maybe St John is treating as evil something that the Jews regarded as sacred. In view of the hostility of the Fourth Gospel - a major Johannine writing - towards "the Jews", maybe the idea has something to be said for it.

    Such an interpretation, if well-founded, would mean that the passage was yet another allusion to the Exodus in a book that contains many allusions to it. It could also mean that these Jews form a contrast to the sealed Jews in Rev.7 - that passage also echoes Ezekiel 9.4, in which those saved from the destruction of Jerusalem by Nebuchadnezzar are by God's command marked with a taw-brand, to show they are His. By contrast, the Jews marked with the MotB are marked by it as subject to the First Beast - and, by implication, go to destruction with him. The cruciform shape of the taw - a St Andrew's cross - might prompt a Christian interpretation of it as foreshadowing the Cross of Christ.

    The First Book of Maccabees mentions that some apostate Jews in the reign of Antiochus IV Epiphanes (175-164) tried to ingratiate themselves with the new Hellenising regime in Jerusalem, by undergoing an operation to reverse their circumcision - the sign of God's Covenant, and of their belonging to Him. The First Beast in Rev 13 has some Antiochus-features, so maybe it is not a stretch to suggest that the persecution and desecration under Antiochus IV were in St John's mind when he wrote this passage of Revelation; especially if the book, or part of it, was written during the Jewish War.

    Given the many vagaries of interpretation to which Revelation in particular has been subjected, anything resembling dogmatism in saying what this or that passage may mean is not a good idea.

    One of the problems with seeing RFID chips in the text, is that this idea requires the First Beast to be around in a culture in which that technology is used. In a culture in which such things are as obsolete as the phonograph or coats of chain mail, the use of RFID chips (& a Biblical allusion to them) would be pointless; so the interpretation requires the First Beast to appear in a culture that uses them, and not something else. A problem with a futurist interpretation is that if these visions are of events in St John's future, they might also be in the interpreters' future - and there is no telling when that future may be. It might, from our POV, be very soon - or in a hundred years' time - or in ten thousand years' time. Futurism might not be an appropriate method by which to read the book (IMHO, it is not). St John may have been talking of RFID chips; or, he may have been referring to entities familiar to his readers in their culture, rather to entities familiar to his later readers in theirs.

  7. #5
    Evolution is God's ID rogue06's Avatar
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    I can remember when there was a lot of hoopla over bar codes and that they were the mark of the beast and how people would be forced to get them tattooed on their body.

    I'm always still in trouble again

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    tWebber
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    Thing is, it was perfectly rational to be alarmed about bar code technology, credit cards and digital currency. There was nothing like it prior to that technology once it became commonplace in society -- what like the 60s-70s? Then immediately came the internet. There has been nothing like this in history that made Rev 13 possible in a literal sense. Though these are all just steps leading in that inevitable direction, since then, technology has exponentially increased at dizzying speed, which increases multifold with each following decade -- or as Kurzweil termed it: law of accelerating returns. The stage we're presently at now, the technology is there. However form it takes, whether it's specifically RFID or not is moot. The technology is possible, so it's now just a matter of populace sentiment willing to accept such a system. That can change rather rapidly too with any number of potential global disasters.

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    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by theophilus View Post
    Alexander Pope wrote:

    A little learning is a dangerous thing;
    Drink deep or taste not the Pierian spring.
    There shallow draughts intoxicate the brain,
    And drinking largely sobers us again.

    (In Greek mythology the Pierian spring was a fountain which was sacred to the Muses and imparted learning to anyone who drank from it.)

    There are times when having just a little learning about what the Bible says can be a dangerous thing.


    Most people have heard of the mark of the beast and they know that it is associated with the number 666 but don’t know anything else about it. One result is that many people are afraid they will take the mark without meaning to and be eternally condemned as a result. Here are two examples.

    The first is from a news story by UPI.

    A Kentucky high school student athlete declined to participate in her team’s cross-country race after she was assigned the number 666, saying it would have gone against her religious beliefs.

    The number 666 is often associated with the biblical “mark of the beast.”

    The second is a post on a Christian forum.

    Hey guys so I’m 17 and after high school I would like to join the military (AIR FORCE!!!) but I’ve read online they might start RFIDing soldiers. I’m worried if I do enlist I will be forced to get the chip and if it turns out to be the mark of the beast…well I’m done for I guess. So can someone tell me about this? Are they really going to do this? If so is the RFID chip the actual mark of the beast? I would appreciate any help I can get guys.

    Are their fears justified? The best way to answer this question is to look at what the Bible actually says about the mark of the beast. First the beast is introduced.

    And I saw a beast rising out of the sea, with ten horns and seven heads, with ten diadems on its horns and blasphemous names on its heads. And the beast that I saw was like a leopard; its feet were like a bear’s, and its mouth was like a lion’s mouth. And to it the dragon gave his power and his throne and great authority.

    One of its heads seemed to have a mortal wound, but its mortal wound was healed, and the whole earth marveled as they followed the beast. And they worshiped the dragon, for he had given his authority to the beast, and they worshiped the beast, saying, “Who is like the beast, and who can fight against it?”
    Revelation 13:1-4 ESV

    The beast will receive power and authority from the dragon, Satan, and will become an object of worship for the whole world.

    And the beast was given a mouth uttering haughty and blasphemous words, and it was allowed to exercise authority for forty-two months. It opened its mouth to utter blasphemies against God, blaspheming his name and his dwelling, that is, those who dwell in heaven. Also it was allowed to make war on the saints and to conquer them.

    And authority was given it over every tribe and people and language and nation, and all who dwell on earth will worship it, everyone whose name has not been written before the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who was slain. If anyone has an ear, let him hear:

    If anyone is to be taken captive,
    to captivity he goes;
    if anyone is to be slain with the sword,
    with the sword must he be slain.

    Here is a call for the endurance and faith of the saints.
    Revelation 13:5-10 ESV

    Then a second beast is introduced.

    Then I saw another beast rising out of the earth. It had two horns like a lamb and it spoke like a dragon. It exercises all the authority of the first beast in its presence, and makes the earth and its inhabitants worship the first beast, whose mortal wound was healed.

    It performs great signs, even making fire come down from heaven to earth in front of people, and by the signs that it is allowed to work in the presence of the beast it deceives those who dwell on earth, telling them to make an image for the beast that was wounded by the sword and yet lived.

    And it was allowed to give breath to the image of the beast, so that the image of the beast might even speak and might cause those who would not worship the image of the beast to be slain.
    Revelation 13:11-15 ESV

    Finally everyone on the earth is required to take the mark.

    Also it causes all, both small and great, both rich and poor, both free and slave, to be marked on the right hand or the forehead, so that no one can buy or sell unless he has the mark, that is, the name of the beast or the number of its name.

    This calls for wisdom: let the one who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man, and his number is 666.
    Revelation 13:16-18 ESV

    The mark of the beast will be given at a time when the beast is ruling the earth and is already requiring that he be worshipped. An order will be issued requiring everyone to take the mark. There will be laws in effect that forbid anyone without the mark to buy or sell. None of those conditions exist today so it isn’t possible for anyone to receive the mark now.

    The number 666 will be associated in some way with the beast but now it is just a number like any other. It is simply one more than 665 and one less than 667. It might not even be the number of the beast. There are some manuscripts of Revelation that have the number 616 instead.

    It is possible that taking the mark may include implanting an RFID chip as a means of identification but if that is true the chip itself won’t be the mark; it will only be a tool used to implement it. An RFID chip is simply a device that can be used for either good or evil purposes. Perhaps the beast will use it for evil; that shouldn’t keep others from using it for good.

    Sometimes having only a little knowledge can be dangerous; the way to remove this danger is to acquire more knowledge. If you are afraid you might accidentally take the mark the best way to overcome your fear is to study Bible prophecy to learn more about what will happen in the future.

    If you want to learn more about prophecy here is a good place to start:

    https://www.raptureready.com/abc/abc.html
    But the funny thing is that those arguments are made by people who insist that they know and understand the bible. Which raises the question: What does it mean to know the bible?

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    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by simplicio View Post
    But the funny thing is that those arguments are made by people who insist that they know and understand the bible. Which raises the question: What does it mean to know the bible?
    Arguing that a biblical understanding should be metaphorical or allegorical or somehow mystical is only necessary as an escape route when modern reality seems to contradict biblical scripture. For example, if one believes that humans evolved from lower primates, then it becomes necessary to take a non-literal approach to Genesis. But in the case of Rev 13, there's no reason not to interpret it literally, since the technology is now in place and exponentially increasing with each decade.

  12. #10
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by seanD View Post
    Arguing that a biblical understanding should be metaphorical or allegorical or somehow mystical is only necessary as an escape route when modern reality seems to contradict biblical scripture. For example, if one believes that humans evolved from lower primates, then it becomes necessary to take a non-literal approach to Genesis. But in the case of Rev 13, there's no reason not to interpret it literally, since the technology is now in place and exponentially increasing with each decade.
    But every passage in the bible is controversial, what does it mean is the all encompassing question. Rushing Jaws above tied the mark to the Old Testament, which suggests that the technology was extant 3000 years ago.

    The ancient Hebrews took it literally. And made the connection to worship and even commerce. So the question is what is the literal?

    Each generation has some who declare with certainty that they understand St John's Apocalypse, and declare that they understand all the signs. And are able to place the times of the signs as that generation.

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