Problems with Heliocentrism

[Christianbookworm]

For the sarcastically impaired the following is said in jest

Donchaknow that anyone can fly with happy thoughts and solar power? It's sad thoughts that weigh you down.

[HMS_Beagle]

Free fall is a concept used by Jim. Whatever free fall is, it is the cause of the satellites keeping pace with the earth. This affect means free fall as a mechanics to account for satellite orbit with the ever moving earth is the cause of the forces placed upon the satellites.

I'm still waiting for your answer to what that force is that causes the satellites to vary in velocity with the earth.

JM

If free fall is imaginary then what causes the apparent weightlessness of objects inside the ISS?

[JohnMartin]

If free fall is imaginary then what causes the apparent weightlessness of objects inside the ISS?

The ISS shows a lack of force. A lack of force does nothing to solve the problem. Free fall infers a similar lack of force to change the satellites velocity with the change in earth's velocity. Your ISS example only shows further evidence for the Helio problem. ISS is against Helio and for Geo.

JM

[HMS_Beagle]

The ISS shows a lack of force. A lack of force does nothing to solve the problem. Free fall infers a similar lack of force to change the satellites velocity with the change in earth's velocity. Your ISS example only shows further evidence for the Helio problem. ISS is against Helio and for Geo.

JM

Do you admit the ISS a real object in orbit around Earth?

[Yttrium]

The ISS shows a lack of force.

Just the opposite. Free fall is falling. Falling occurs because of a force pulling them down. Everything in the ISS is falling at the same acceleration.

[oxmixmudd]

The ISS shows a lack of force. A lack of force does nothing to solve the problem. Free fall infers a similar lack of force to change the satellites velocity with the change in earth's velocity. Your ISS example only shows further evidence for the Helio problem. ISS is against Helio and for Geo.

JM

John lives on de Nile ...

It's been an interesting lesson in why so many issues in the world remain unsettled. If a person does not want to understand, them can't be made to understand.

John - Gravitational attraction can be observed in action all accross the universe and the solar system. The moons of jupiter. They orbit Jupiter. Yet Jupiter orbits the sun. We can WATCH this happen, and EVEN YOU acknowledge Jupiter goes around the sun.

The same with Saturn and its moons.

The same with Uranus and its moons.

The same with Neptune and its moons.

The same with Pluto and its moons.

The same with Mars and its moons.

The same with Ceres, and Eros, and the comets, and the Kuiper belt objects.

The are multiple double asteroids that we can also watch and observe.

From these objects, their sizes, relative densities, we can compute the force of gravity as it varies by mass. We can observe how it behaves and what multiple objects do in simultaneous orbits around themselve and around the Sun.

What is proposed relative to the Earth, Moon and Satellites is identical to what we observe happening on ALL the other objects in the solar system, larger and smaller than the Earth.

Only someone with their head hidden in the sand would not be able to make the connection.

But there is no law against willful ignorance, and it sure does get you lots of attention.




Jim

[JohnMartin]

Do you admit the ISS a real object in orbit around Earth?

I'm currently agnostic about the ISS. Maybe it does exist. But there seem to be big problems with men living in space.

JM

[JohnMartin]

John lives on de Nile ...

It's been an interesting lesson in why so many issues in the world remain unsettled. If a person does not want to understand, them can't be made to understand.

John - Gravitational attraction can be observed in action all accross the universe and the solar system. The moons of jupiter. They orbit Jupiter. Yet Jupiter orbits the sun. We can WATCH this happen, and EVEN YOU acknowledge Jupiter goes around the sun.

The same with Saturn and its moons.

The same with Uranus and its moons.

The same with Neptune and its moons.

The same with Pluto and its moons.

The same with Mars and its moons.

The same with Ceres, and Eros, and the comets, and the Kuiper belt objects.

The are multiple double asteroids that we can also watch and observe.

From these objects, their sizes, relative densities, we can compute the force of gravity as it varies by mass. We can observe how it behaves and what multiple objects do in simultaneous orbits around themselve and around the Sun.

What is proposed relative to the Earth, Moon and Satellites is identical to what we observe happening on ALL the other objects in the solar system, larger and smaller than the Earth.

Only someone with their head hidden in the sand would not be able to make the connection.

But there is no law against willful ignorance, and it sure does get you lots of attention.




Jim

The ISS shows evidence for the problem with the Helio model. The satellites require a force to change velocity with the earth. The astronomers move within the ISS and hence change velocity by applying a force. Man moves from left to right by grabbing onto the wall and pushing/pulling. The change in velocity occurs apart from the gravity field causing the velocity. Likewise the satellite change in velocity also requires an additional force to cause the change in velocity.

The force on the satellite does not exist. Regardless of whether gravity exists or not.

Jim's latest rant ignores the problem being discussed. Jim does this because he has no answer to the problem posed with satellites in the Helio model.

JM

[HMS_Beagle]

I'm currently agnostic about the ISS. Maybe it does exist. But there seem to be big problems with men living in space.

JM

Make a commitment coward. There have been over 10,000 space vehicle launches since 1958 by a dozen different countries. They include Earth orbiting satellites at altitudes from 100 mi. to 22,000 mi, deep space probes to most of the planets, lunar landing missions, sun orbiters like EPIC. Any single one kills your Geo claims deader than dead.

Either they all exist or they're all frauds by all the space capable countries, not just NASA. So pick a position and stick with it.

[JohnMartin]

Make a commitment coward. There have been over 10,000 space vehicle launches since 1958 by a dozen different countries. They include Earth orbiting satellites at altitudes from 100 mi. to 22,000 mi, deep space probes to most of the planets, lunar landing missions, sun orbiters like EPIC. Any single one kills your Geo claims deader than dead.

Either they all exist or they're all frauds by all the space capable countries, not just NASA. So pick a position and stick with it.

How so?

JM

[oxmixmudd]

The ISS shows evidence for the problem with the Helio model. The satellites require a force to change velocity with the earth. The astronomers move within the ISS and hence change velocity by applying a force. Man moves from left to right by grabbing onto the wall and pushing/pulling. The change in velocity occurs apart from the gravity field causing the velocity. Likewise the satellite change in velocity also requires an additional force to cause the change in velocity.

The force on the satellite does not exist. Regardless of whether gravity exists or not.

Jim's latest rant ignores the problem being discussed. Jim does this because he has no answer to the problem posed with satellites in the Helio model.

JM

Any idiot can read a set of posts that answer a question asked and then claim they did not actually answer the questions raised.

Jim

[JohnMartin]

Any idiot can read a set of posts that answer a question asked and then claim they did not actually answer the questions raised.

Jim

An idiot can claim the posts answered the question when my rebuttal posts to your posts remain unanswered.

JM

[HMS_Beagle]

How so?

JM

Space launches are incredibly expensive, countries don't shoot them off just for a lark. Every one was designed with very specific orbital parameters to go to very specific places. Every last one 100% relied on the fact that the Earth rotates below them in 23 hr. 56 minutes to achieve their operational goals.

Every last deep space probe also 100% relies on the fact the Earth and the other planets are orbiting the sun to achieve its trajectory parameters. Many used the technique of gravity assist to get a "slingshot" effect and achieve higher velocities.

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[Roy]

Also, every last one of them used the rotation of the Earth to get a speed boost on take-off. Otherwise why do they all launch Eastwards?

[Leonhard]

John Martin, cassini, and a bunch of other similar posters belong to a very small group of Catholic radicals who believe that geocentrism is taught as dogma by the Church, and that anyone who denies geocentrism won't achieve salvation. They often liken denying geocentrism, to denying Christ's Ressurection.

It should be noted that this borders on a heresy, since Catholics believe that the Church cannot obscure from believers what is required for salvation.