New dino-bird fossil

[SteveF]

Xu, X. et al. (2007) A gigantic bird-like dinosaur from the Late Cretaceous of China. Nature, 447, 844-847.

An evolutionary trend of decreasing size is present along the line to birds in coelurosaurian theropod evolution1, 2, but size increases are seen in many coelurosaurian subgroups, in which large forms are less bird-like2, 3. Here we report on a new non-avian dinosaur, Gigantoraptor erlianensis, gen. et sp. nov., from the Late Cretaceous Iren Dabasu Formation of Nei Mongol, China. Although it has a body mass of about 1,400 kg, a phylogenetic analysis positions this new taxon within the Oviraptorosauria, a group of small, feathered theropods rarely exceeding 40 kg in body mass2, 4, 5, 6, 7. A histological analysis suggests that Gigantoraptor gained this size by a growth rate considerably faster than large North American tyrannosaurs such as Albertosaurus and Gorgosaurus8. Gigantoraptor possesses several salient features previously unknown in any other dinosaur and its hind limb bone scaling and proportions are significantly different from those of other coelurosaurs9, 10, thus increasing the morphological diversity among dinosaurs. Most significantly, the gigantic Gigantoraptor shows many bird-like features absent in its smaller oviraptorosaurian relatives, unlike the evolutionary trend seen in many other coelurosaurian subgroups2, 3.

Here's a news article:

http://www.nature.com/news/2007/0706.../070611-9.html

[FreezBee]

Here's a news article:

http://www.nature.com/news/2007/0706.../070611-9.html

Interesting article, Steve

I noticed this:

http://www.nature.com/

The Gigantoraptor's diet is a mystery. It has the small head and long neck of a herbivore, but the sharp claws of a carnivore.

© source where applicable

Wonder, what AiG would get out of that.


And this

http://www.nature.com/

Gigantoraptor had long arms, bird-like legs, a toothless jaw, and probably a beak. There are no clear signs as to whether it was feathered. However, judging from its close affinity to other dinosaurs known to have been feathered, Xing Xu of the Institute of Vertebrate Paleontology and Paleoanthropology in Beijing speculates that it was.

© source where applicable

Is Xing Xu doing some safe guessing here? Or is the close affinity to "other dinosaurs known to have been feathered" irrelevant? Why would a very large dinosaur have feathers?


- FreezBee

[Jorge]

Interesting article, Steve

I noticed this:

http://www.nature.com/

The Gigantoraptor's diet is a mystery. It has the small head and long neck of a herbivore, but the sharp claws of a carnivore.

© source where applicable

Wonder, what AiG would get out of that.

Everybody head for the hills -- another Chinese "dinobird" has surfaced!!! gaaaauuuuuck!

Is Xing Xu doing some safe guessing here? Or is the close affinity to "other dinosaurs known to have been feathered" irrelevant? Why would a very large dinosaur have feathers?

Why the feathers, you ask? So it can fly, you Dodo. Here's why it went extinct : back then (those umpteen million years ago) they were downsizing landing strips. Due to it's large size this guy needed real long ones. Anyway, with the shorter strips these guys crashed and burned regularly and, ergo, became extinct. Only the smaller flying dinosaurs survived to become ... what else? ... birds!

You may publish that in Nature or Science (the really scary part is that with a few modfications they actually might publish it!).

Jorge

[Mark Little]

Everybody head for the hills -- another Chinese "dinobird" has surfaced!!! gaaaauuuuuck!

No, it must be real - it was all saddled up - it's actually an Aigosaurus, so there is no need to worry.

[FreezBee]

Everybody head for the hills -- another Chinese "dinobird" has surfaced!!! gaaaauuuuuck!

Ok, not bad -- I was, however, thinking more in direction of, what it would have been feeding on.

Oranges? Using its claws to remove the peal?

Why the feathers, you ask? So it can fly, you Dodo. Here's why it went extinct : back then (those umpteen million years ago) they were downsizing landing strips. Due to it's large size this guy needed real long ones. Anyway, with the shorter strips these guys crashed and burned regularly and, ergo, became extinct. Only the smaller flying dinosaurs survived to become ... what else? ... birds!

Doesn't work -- it would need the same size of landing strips for taking off. If it couldn't take off, it wouldn't need to land

Possibly it used the feathers to catch pollen to spice the oranges with?


- FreezBee

[shadowmaster]

Ok, not bad -- I was, however, thinking more in direction of, what it would have been feeding on.

Oranges? Using its claws to remove the peal?




Doesn't work -- it would need the same size of landing strips for taking off. If it couldn't take off, it wouldn't need to land

Possibly it used the feathers to catch pollen to spice the oranges with?


- FreezBee

WRONG!

The feathers were used to tickle lady dinobirds.

shadowmaster

[FreezBee]

WRONG!

The feathers were used to tickle lady dinobirds.

And what did the lady dinobirds use their feathers for, good sir?

(And don't say that they used them as a mask to hide from the male dinobirds)


- FreezBee

[shadowmaster]

And what did the lady dinobirds use their feathers for, good sir?

(And don't say that they used them as a mask to hide from the male dinobirds)


- FreezBee

Dang. You guessed it.

SM

[rogue06]

This new finding, a (possibly) feathered dinosaur nearly 35 times bigger than similar feathered dinosaurs sure causes us to do some serious re-thinking. And being this was a young adult it is probable that it could have gotten larger still.

Interesting article, Steve

I noticed this:

http://www.nature.com/

The Gigantoraptor's diet is a mystery. It has the small head and long neck of a herbivore, but the sharp claws of a carnivore.

This seems similar to Falcarius utahensis, a transitional between the meat-eatting raptors it descended from and the fully plant-eatting Therizinosaur that it evolved into.

Everybody head for the hills -- another Chinese "dinobird" has surfaced!!! gaaaauuuuuck!

That's right Jorge, just because there was one misrepresented they all must be suspect. I undertand that the faked Hitler Diaries released several years ago were created in Germany, hence [u]everything[u] on paper from that country must be fake. Right? So, all you YECs that think Jorge has a valid point here, please send me any Deutschmarks you run across since they're most likely just more German fakes.


Thanks for the post SteveF

[TheGreenMan]

This seems similar to Falcarius utahensis, a transitional between the meat-eatting raptors it descended from and the fully plant-eatting Therizinosaur that it evolved into.

Dang, you beat me too it.

[rogue06]

While re-reading the article I noticed this:

The evolution of bird-like features had long been thought to be accompanied by a decrease in size, meaning the smaller the species, the more bird-like it is likely to be and vice versa. The new discovery shows that isn't necessarily true.

This is like early theories about the evolution of the horse. Once thought to be rather straight-line, progressing from short to tall, multi-toed to single toe, leaf eater to grass eater. As more and more fossil evidence accumulated we learned that evolution doesn't progress so linearly, that the process is much more complex and much messier. Better illustrated by a bush than a ladder. I suspect as more feathered dinosaur fossil material is discovered we'll see that their evolutionary progression was no less convoluted and complex.

[FreezBee]

Here's a news article:

http://www.nature.com/news/2007/0706.../070611-9.html

Just for the record: AiG has an article up about the dino-bird: Another feathered dinosaur?


From that article:

AiG

As you can see, the true reasoning behind the expectation for feathers comes from the preconceptions that the researchers have. Because of its “affinity” to dinosaurs that are believed to have feathers, Gigantoraptor is passed off as something akin to a comical, giant ostrich.

The problem is, with the bones unlikely to be examined by a creationist paleontologist anytime soon, Gigantoraptor will no doubt be added to the list of “missing links” between dinosaurs and birds. Scant fossils are increasingly being shoehorned into evolutionary roles, with fanciful extrapolations trumping careful analysis of actual unearthed bones; this treatment yields what are often little more than modern-day “Nebraska men.”

© source where applicable

Now, things are not quite that simple.

From the quote in the OP:

Most significantly, the gigantic Gigantoraptor shows many bird-like features absent in its smaller oviraptorosaurian relatives, unlike the evolutionary trend seen in many other coelurosaurian subgroup.

So, as with Archaeopteryx, it's not just those feathers (that aren't there in this case), but 'many bird-like features'.

Also, it is doubtful that Gigantoraptor should be counted as a "missing link", rather it will be seen as one of many bird-like dinosaurs, but not an direct ancestor of modern birds.


- FreezBee

[rogue06]

This line from the above post from FreezBee nearly made me blow my orange juice through my nose

The problem is, with the bones unlikely to be examined by a creationist paleontologist anytime soon...

Creationist paleontologist!

[SteveF]

Why on earth would they need to be described by a creationist palaeontologist? They have the paper, that should be enough. I thought YECs were all about scientists collecting the same data but interpreting it differently. Apparently they'll use any old excuse to deny evidence.

[showmeproof]

Does any one know how paleontologists distinguish juveniles from adults?