Creationist kills evolutionist in row over Bible

[MooseOnTheLoose]

THE TIMES (UK) 17th JULY

An English tourist and creationist has been convicted of the death of a Scots scientist after a heated argument about religion and evolution got out of hand. At a campsite in New Zealand, the Scot died after a single knife blow severed an artery in his chest.

The defendant was convicted of manslaughter after the court accepted that 'he did not mean to kill' his victim.

www.timesonline.co.uk

Needless to say, this is not good.

[rogue06]

Yikes! Suddenly the alleged threats directed against several biologists at the University of Colorado by an anti-evolution Messianic Jew named Philip Korn takes on a more serious nature.

For more about this case, check out http://www.pandasthumb.org/archives/...gists.html]the story on the Panda's Thumb[/quote].

[rogue06]

Oops. Messed up the link:

http://www.pandasthumb.org/archives/...iologists.html

[Jnthn]

I would have expected this kind of innuendo from Minnesota, not a self-styled Christian.

[UPDATE]

The only reference I can find to the event on the Times website is here, where there is no mention of the reason for the argument.

The BBC report, again, makes no mention of the "cause", but makes an important point about the verdict:

The only witness to the incident, Mr Boa's girlfriend Gillian Brown, from Nairn, near Inverness, gave evidence during the trial that York's actions were deliberate following an argument between the couple and York at a local hotel, where they had been drinking together.

The manslaughter verdict meant the jury accepted York's defence that he either stabbed Mr Boa accidentally or in self-defence.

There is only a vague allusion to "religion" in the report in The Scotsman report.

Interestingly, there is no consensus in the reports over whether there was a single or multiple stabbing.

J

[Crow]

I kinda think that if you stab someone in the chest that should be taken as evidence that you're trying to kill them.

There are, IMHO, legitimate reasons to kill someone, such as in the defense of one's life. A creation vs evolution argument is not a legitimate reason. I'd judge this as-

1) Intentional taking of a human life

2) No legitimate cause for taking a human life

therefore, unless the other guy attacked him and he was defending himself in fear for being gravely wounded or killed (can't find the article) murder.

[rogue06]

I would have expected this kind of innuendo from Minnesota, not a self-styled Christian.

???


Where was the innuendo? Nobody has asserted or even hinted at anything here except to mention a couple of troubling cases. The individuals involved here are basically nuts, and nobody is trying to blame this on Christianity, Creationism, Messianic Jews or anything else. But if you prefer to just ignore these and choose to attack the messenger... so be it.

[Jnthn]

???


Where was the innuendo? Nobody has asserted or even hinted at anything here except to mention a couple of troubling cases. The individuals involved here are basically nuts, and nobody is trying to blame this on Christianity, Creationism, Messianic Jews or anything else. But if you prefer to just ignore these and choose to attack the messenger... so be it.

The majority of the credible news sources do not mention anything about the protagonists' views (including The Times) yet in your post, the second in the thread, you clearly infer that creationists are prone to physical, murderous violence.

The facts of the case are a couple of people got drunk, someone was killed accidentally or the survivor defended himself.

J

[rogue06]

The majority of the credible news sources do not mention anything about the protagonists' views (including The Times) yet in your post, the second in the thread, you clearly infer that creationists are prone to physical, murderous violence.

If that is what you got out of my post you are most profoundly mistaken. Sadly, it is apparent that you have already decided what I mean and what my intent is. Not what I would expect from a self-styled Christian.

[Minnesota]

The court had earlier heard that York had been involved in an argument with Mr Boa and Ms Brown over the evolution debate.

source

Alexander York, 31, a fellow tourist from Essex, had been charged originally with murdering Mr Boa at a caravan park in New South Wales after a late-night row over the evolution debate.


source

[MooseOnTheLoose]

The actual physical copy of the newspaper itself clearly states the cause of the killing as being an argument over religion. The words 'Creationist', 'evolution', 'religion' and 'Bible' are used in the headlines, sub-headlines and text.

Believe me, I wouldn't make this up, whatever treatment the website chooses to give the article.

[Jnthn]

If that is what you got out of my post you are most profoundly mistaken. Sadly, it is apparent that you have already decided what I mean and what my intent is. Not what I would expect from a self-styled Christian.

If your first offering had nothing to do with the OP, why were you trying to derail the thread? As I have demonstrated, this was an alcohol-fuelled accidental death (at worst, self defense at best) and in response you offer the tale of threats of violence from an anti-Evolutionary kook.

The link is obvious: you are equating the supposed creationist from the OP with the anti-evolutionist in your post, and by extension creating an innuendo about violent creationists.

J

[Jnthn]

The actual physical copy of the newspaper itself clearly states the cause of the killing as being an argument over religion. The words 'Creationist', 'evolution', 'religion' and 'Bible' are used in the headlines, sub-headlines and text.

Believe me, I wouldn't make this up, whatever treatment the website chooses to give the article.

Why did you link to the web edition if you were not linking to the primary source?

J

[MooseOnTheLoose]

Why did you link to the web edition if you were not linking to the primary source?

The primary source is quoted at the beginning of my post.

...and I can't hand you a copy of the newspaper.

[Jnthn]

The court had earlier heard that York had been involved in an argument with Mr Boa and Ms Brown over the evolution debate.

source

Alexander York, 31, a fellow tourist from Essex, had been charged originally with murdering Mr Boa at a caravan park in New South Wales after a late-night row over the evolution debate.


source

From those sources it's evident that the primary aggrivating factors were drunkenness and cannabis.

J

[Jnthn]

Why did you link to the web edition if you were not linking to the primary source?

The primary source is quoted at the beginning of my post.

...and I can't hand you a copy of the newspaper.

No, what you said was "THE TIMES (UK) 17th JULY" which makes no mention of the medium. It does not say the print edition, but by linking to the web site it is not an unreasonable conclusion to draw that you were directing the reader to the primary source.

It would be like saying "the BBC reported..." when the BBC is a multimedia organisation with extensive presence on TV, Radio and Internet to name but three.

J