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US interventionism in Israel and End Times (Poll)

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  • #31
    Originally posted by Terraceth View Post
    The thing is... despite people claiming she did, she really didn't, at least if we're referring to this article. The supposed end time mention comes in an offhand remark at the end:

    "There will be no Ottoman empires or Shia nations that will destroy Jerusalem any longer. Donald Trump recognized history. He, like King Cyrus before him, fulfilled the biblical prophecy of the gods worshipped by Jews, Christians and, yes, Muslims, that Jerusalem is the eternal capital of the Jewish state and that the Jewish people deserve a righteous, free and sovereign Israel."

    The thing is, there's a mention of a prophecy (not sure which one?) but nothing mentioned about the end times. The point of the remark is just to draw a favorable comparison between Trump and Cyrus, not to make any prediction of the end of the world. I guess people just saw "biblical prophecy" and automatically conflated it with end times mania but there's nothing about that actually mentioned.
    It's a real worry when people start supporting international security based upon the alleged prophecies of a book of man-made myths and folk-lore deriving from the Bronze Age.
    “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
      A 2-state solution was implemented back in 1948: Jews would get from the Jordan to the Mediterranean, and Arabs would get all of TransJordan, a significantly larger area. It wasn't "viable" because the Arabs demanded all of both sides of the river. The Palestinians still demand all of both sides of the river - except for the West Bank leadership, which pretends otherwise
      ???
      In the 2000 Camp David negotiations, the Palestinian negotiators' goal was to get themselves 22% of the territory that comprised historic Palestine (Gaza and the West Bank), and that they would let Israel have the remaining 78%. I am sure that if today's Palestinians could go back in time and accept some of the agreements earlier in the 20th century that offered them a lot more, they would. But all they're asking for today is one fifth of the total territory.

      (the last time the Palestinians were proffered 99% of what they said they wanted, the launched the Second Intifada in response
      What an absurd statement.

      Here's the BBC on the subject:
      The second Palestinian intifada or uprising broke out at the end of September 2000 and is named after the Jerusalem mosque complex where the violence began.

      Frustrations that years of the negotiation had failed to deliver a Palestinian state were intensified by the collapse of the Camp David summit in July 2000.

      Ariel Sharon, then the leader of Israel's opposition, paid a visit to the site in East Jerusalem known to Muslims as Haram al-Sharif, and to Jews as Temple Mount, which houses the al-Aqsa mosque - and frustration boiled over into violence.
      You make it sound like what happened was:
      Israel: "We make an offer of 99% of what you want"
      Palestinians: "You dare make us reasonable offers? WARRRR!!!"

      When what really happened was that Palestinians had wanted a state for years and tried and tried and tried to negotiate for one, and only after that failed did they have the uprising.

      There is no viable peace process, and there will not be until the Palestinians love their children more than they hate Israel.

      Palestinians don't love their children? Do you realize how insane you sound? That's up there with Ben Shapiro's claim that Arabs like to... live in open sewage.
      "I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
      "Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
      "[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by Starlight View Post
        We covered Israel/Palestine in History classes at my high school.
        I'm honestly surprised you would use this to justify a worldview.
        The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by Starlight View Post
          You make it sound like what happened was:
          Israel: "We make an offer of 99% of what you want"
          Palestinians: "You dare make us reasonable offers? WARRRR!!!"
          The Palestinians didn't actually want reasonable offers, which is why they rejected it.
          Originally posted by OBP
          There is no viable peace process, and there will not be until the Palestinians love their children more than they hate Israel.

          Palestinians don't love their children? Do you realize how insane you sound?
          Do you realize that's not what I said? The rest of my sentence is not unimportant. Hamas (and Hezbollah) are more than willing to launch rockets from schools and hospitals, knowingly putting their children and vulnerable ones at risk. They're more than willing to use children as 'suicide' bombers. They teach their children hatred of Israel, perpetuating the cycle of hate.
          Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

          Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
          sigpic
          I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
            Do you realize that's not what I said? The rest of my sentence is not unimportant. Hamas (and Hezbollah) are more than willing to launch rockets from schools and hospitals, knowingly putting their children and vulnerable ones at risk. They're more than willing to use children as 'suicide' bombers. They teach their children hatred of Israel, perpetuating the cycle of hate.
            "Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us"
            Golda Meir as quoted in A Land of Our Own : An Oral Autobiography (1973) edited by Marie Syrkin, p. 242
            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by Starlight View Post
              That's up there with Ben Shapiro's claim that Arabs like to... live in open sewage.
              While that comment is a bit extreme, if you've ever been to Israel, you would see that the Israeli controlled sections are FAR more "neat and clean" than the "Palestinian" controlled sections. It's starkly apparent.
              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by Starlight View Post
                Palestinians don't love their children? Do you realize how insane you sound? That's up there with Ben Shapiro's claim that Arabs like to... live in open sewage.
                Ah, so the entire quote, from which you cherry picked, was "Israelis like to build. Arabs like to bomb crap and live in open sewage. This is not a difficult issue."

                Israelis like to build - check - Israelis are building all over Israel.
                Arabs like to bomb crap - check - missiles, rockets, suicide bombs...
                ...and live in open sewage - not so "check" () - I wouldn't say they LIKE to live in open sewage - the Arabs I talk to in Israel are very bitter about that - but it's their OWN GOVERNMENT that fails to provide clean water. When you go through the Arab-controlled sections of Israel, the Jews like to point out that nearly every house has it's own 'black barrel' on the roof, trying to provide their own water, because their government fails to do so.

                cisterns.jpg
                The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by Starlight View Post
                  I note you fail to state even a single thing that was wrong in my analysis (other than it not agreeing with your own misunderstanding of the situation).
                  Yeah I have learned not to get sucked into your delusions and pretty much just tell you what a nut you are and move on. I have better things to do with my time.

                  We covered Israel/Palestine in History classes at my high school. More recently I've listened to a lot of ex-Muslim and ex-Jewish US commentators on the subject. I feel I am well-versed on the history.
                  I am sure you do.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                    While that comment is a bit extreme, if you've ever been to Israel, you would see that the Israeli controlled sections are FAR more "neat and clean" than the "Palestinian" controlled sections. It's starkly apparent.
                    And from this you think it's reasonable to draw the conclusion that this isn't the result of decades of oppression and persecution, but rather that the people-group itself ('Arabs' as Shapiro put it) is deficient and incapable of managing themselves?

                    Just to remind you, here's the city of Dubai that this deficient 'Arab' people group built in the United Arab Emerites:


                    Here's their racial deficiency and incompetence as proven by the capital of Qatar:


                    Do those various facts in your mind support the generalization that:
                    Ben Shapiro:
                    "Israelis like to build. Arabs like to bomb crap and live in open sewage. This is not a difficult issue. #settlementsrock"
                    Do Arabs in general not like to build? Are they in general content with living in open sewage? Are they just a deficient people-group when it comes to construction compared to Jews? Or, perhaps has what has been done to the Arabs in Palestine terrible, leaving them with awful living conditions?
                    "I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
                    "Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
                    "[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Starlight View Post
                      And from this you think it's reasonable to draw the conclusion that this isn't the result of decades of oppression and persecution, but rather that the people-group itself ('Arabs' as Shapiro put it) is deficient and incapable of managing themselves?

                      Just to remind you, here's the city of Dubai that this deficient 'Arab' people group built in the United Arab Emerites:
                      You've ignorantly created your own trap. If the Arabs are so "oppressed and persecuted", why don't these FILTHY RICH Arabs come to their aid?

                      And, it's Emirates.
                      The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                        You've ignorantly created your own trap. If the Arabs are so "oppressed and persecuted", why don't these FILTHY RICH Arabs come to their aid?
                        Wow, your racism knows no bounds... when some Arabs are poor it's evidence to you they're a deficient and defective people, and when they're rich it's evidence to you they're a deficient and defective people...

                        Their situation actually reminds me of America:

                        UN shocked by level of poverty in Alabama: 'We haven't seen this in the first world':
                        "I saw homes that are not connected to public sewage systems, whose owners can't afford to install septic tanks. Many resort to digging ditches & straight piping waste water to within meters of homes... I haven’t seen [anything as bad as] this [before]" - UN Inspector
                        Apparently Americans 'like to live in sewage' rather than build!

                        And elsewhere in the country there are FILTHY RICH Americans, which obviously just proves the moral bankruptcy and deficiency of the entire American race (by your logic).

                        I guess some race that can build stuff rather than sit in sewage, like Arabs from Dubai, should come and kick Americans out of their homes and take their land, and run the country instead...
                        "I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
                        "Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
                        "[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Starlight View Post
                          Wow, your racism knows no bounds...
                          Oh, here we go with the snowflake nonsense.

                          when some Arabs are poor it's evidence to you they're a deficient and defective people, and when they're rich it's evidence to you they're a deficient and defective people...
                          What a steamin' load of horsiepoo.

                          The point is that the Arab world does not WANT the 'Palestinian" problem resolved --- they want to hang on to it to fuel their stated aspirations that Israel be wiped off the face of the earth. Something you ignorantly claim they retracted, and I proved otherwise.
                          The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Starlight View Post
                            And from this you think it's reasonable to draw the conclusion that this isn't the result of decades of oppression and persecution, but rather that the people-group itself ('Arabs' as Shapiro put it) is deficient and incapable of managing themselves?
                            It is not the abilities of the Arabs who are being demeaned here, just the actions of the Arabs in charge of those specific areas. If Arabs wanted to make things better they would be better.
                            Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Starlight View Post
                              Do Arabs in general not like to build? Are they in general content with living in open sewage? Are they just a deficient people-group when it comes to construction compared to Jews? Or, perhaps has what has been done to the Arabs in Palestine terrible, leaving them with awful living conditions?
                              When Israel refused to let back in those who'd left to get out of the way of their Arab compatriots (as they'd asked), their Arab compatriots left them to rot. When, in a fit of pique, their Arab compatriots kicked out all their Jewish population to retaliate, Israel welcomed them.

                              There's your difference.
                              Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                              Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                              sigpic
                              I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                                "Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us"
                                Golda Meir as quoted in A Land of Our Own : An Oral Autobiography (1973) edited by Marie Syrkin, p. 242
                                IS-627x374.jpg
                                Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                                Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                                sigpic
                                I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

                                Comment

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