Announcement

Collapse

Philosophy 201 Guidelines

Cogito ergo sum

Here in the Philosophy forum we will talk about all the "why" questions. We'll have conversations about the way in which philosophy and theology and religion interact with each other. Metaphysics, ontology, origins, truth? They're all fair game so jump right in and have some fun! But remember...play nice!

Forum Rules: Here
See more
See less

Existential comics punches scientism in the face, writes articulate blog post why.

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Existential comics punches scientism in the face, writes articulate blog post why.

    The Philosophy Force Five vs the Scientismists

    "Scientism" is the position that Science can solve all problems, or that all problems are empirical. Philosophically, it is mostly associated with the strongest statements made by the logical positivism movement, which mostly died out in the mid 20th century. Culturally, however, it is stronger than ever, and is closely tied to movements like the so-called "New Atheists". These newer, more naive forms of Scientism, also have a strong tendency to call philosophy "a big waste of time", "pointless arguing", "nothing but semantics", etc. Rhetorically, they tend to say that non-empirical ideas have no way to guarantee they are true, so are pointless to talk about. This is a rather ridiculous point to make, since their entire movement is based around spreading a certain set of non-empirical, philosophical norms, which they apparently don't feel it necessary to open up to criticism.
    Sorry, not sorry, NDGT, Dawkins, Sam Harris, et al.
    Last edited by Jin-roh; 06-23-2017, 11:28 AM. Reason: Autocorrect...

  • #2
    Originally posted by Jin-roh View Post
    The Philosophy Force Five vs the Scientismists
    Sorry, not sorry, NDGT, Dawkins, Sam Harris, et al.
    What are the chances that the Force Five would use strictly empirical methodology to completely discredit Christianity before discarding that methodology to stare at their own navels and explore their feelings? The goofiness of the mid-20th century has done its damage, the weapon may now be discarded, it is now time to move onto the end game.
    Actually YOU put Trump in the White House. He wouldn't have gotten 1% of the vote if it wasn't for the widespread spiritual and cultural devastation caused by progressive policies. There's no "this country" left with your immigration policies, your "allies" are worthless and even more suicidal than you are and democracy is a sick joke that I hope nobody ever thinks about repeating when the current order collapses. - Darth_Executor striking a conciliatory note in Civics 101

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Meh Gerbil View Post
      What are the chances that the Force Five would use strictly empirical methodology to completely discredit Christianity before discarding that methodology to stare at their own navels and explore their feelings? The goofiness of the mid-20th century has done its damage, the weapon may now be discarded, it is now time to move onto the end game.
      Gerbil, you realize that not all of those figures were mid 20th century... and... that not all of them would be called "empiricists" ... and ... at least two of them were theists?

      .....right?

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Jin-roh View Post
        Gerbil, you realize that not all of those figures were mid 20th century... and... that not all of them would be called "empiricists" ... and ... at least two of them were theists?

        .....right?
        Didn't read the comic.

        I'm so accustomed to people going hard core empiricist to disprove Christianity only to revert to some weird, unproven pseudo-spiritual nonsense for their daily living while being completely oblivious to the hypocrisy (See: Shunyadragon) that it governs my off the cuff remarks.

        Didn't mean to offend.
        Actually YOU put Trump in the White House. He wouldn't have gotten 1% of the vote if it wasn't for the widespread spiritual and cultural devastation caused by progressive policies. There's no "this country" left with your immigration policies, your "allies" are worthless and even more suicidal than you are and democracy is a sick joke that I hope nobody ever thinks about repeating when the current order collapses. - Darth_Executor striking a conciliatory note in Civics 101

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Meh Gerbil View Post
          Didn't read the comic.
          So why comment at all? Honestly, that seemed super pre-judgy of you.

          I'm so accustomed to people going hard core empiricist to disprove Christianity only to revert to some weird, unproven pseudo-spiritual nonsense for their daily living while being completely oblivious to the hypocrisy (See: Shunyadragon) that it governs my off the cuff remarks.
          Uh-huh...

          The comic and the blog criticizes scientism and their pop-advocates -the new athiests-, and makes no comment on Christianity or mysticism.

          Didn't mean to offend.
          Think of how your reply made you look Gerbil. That's all.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Jin-roh View Post
            Think of how your reply made you look Gerbil. That's all.
            I was attempting to express the idea that I think hitting a mid-20th Century target is waste of time.
            Clowns like those mentioned have already been defeated - I wish strict empiricists were our problem.

            By the way, how did you learn to communicate so much pompous gas-baggery in so few words?
            I'd have to write an entire paragraph to communicate that degree of arrogance.
            Take a look around your one room studio apartment, piled high with books, and ask the stuffed cat on the milk crates (aka: Princess) if the pretension has been worth it.
            Actually YOU put Trump in the White House. He wouldn't have gotten 1% of the vote if it wasn't for the widespread spiritual and cultural devastation caused by progressive policies. There's no "this country" left with your immigration policies, your "allies" are worthless and even more suicidal than you are and democracy is a sick joke that I hope nobody ever thinks about repeating when the current order collapses. - Darth_Executor striking a conciliatory note in Civics 101

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Meh Gerbil View Post
              I was attempting to express the idea that I think hitting a mid-20th Century target is waste of time.
              Clowns like those mentioned have already been defeated - I wish strict empiricists were our problem.
              So still not reading the thing... then.

              By the way, how did you learn to communicate so much pompous gas-baggery in so few words?
              Messageboards!

              I have no problem calling out people who express opinions on things, without having read those things.

              I'd have to write an entire paragraph to communicate that degree of arrogance.
              That would be a lot for you?

              Take a look around your one room studio apartment, piled high with books, and ask the stuffed cat on the milk crates (aka: Princess) if the pretension has been worth it.
              Princess only speaks the truth -like that sitar on Moulin Rouge- and reminds me why the thing was posted.

              If the blog and the comic are not of actual interest to you, and you kinda just need to post whatever's in your head already, than you my find a "I hate Shunyadragon's empiricism and pseudo-spiritual nonsense" thread worth starting.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Jin-roh View Post
                If the blog and the comic are not of actual interest to you, and you kinda just need to post whatever's in your head already, than you my find a "I hate Shunyadragon's empiricism and pseudo-spiritual nonsense" thread worth starting.
                The Existential comics were hitting the men you enumerated.
                I responded that such a target may be poorly considered.

                That is on topic.

                You obviously don't care to discuss that, which is fine.
                I'll leave you be.

                Actually YOU put Trump in the White House. He wouldn't have gotten 1% of the vote if it wasn't for the widespread spiritual and cultural devastation caused by progressive policies. There's no "this country" left with your immigration policies, your "allies" are worthless and even more suicidal than you are and democracy is a sick joke that I hope nobody ever thinks about repeating when the current order collapses. - Darth_Executor striking a conciliatory note in Civics 101

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Meh Gerbil View Post
                  Didn't read the comic.

                  I'm so accustomed to people going hard core empiricist to disprove Christianity only to revert to some weird, unproven pseudo-spiritual nonsense for their daily living while being completely oblivious to the hypocrisy (See: Shunyadragon) that it governs my off the cuff remarks.

                  Didn't mean to offend.
                  You were right to suspect something is amiss, the whole thing is intended to be an apologia for modern feminism. This becomes clear if you read the piece after the actual comic.
                  "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

                  There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Darth Executor View Post
                    You were right to suspect something is amiss, the whole thing is intended to be an apologia for modern feminism. This becomes clear if you read the piece after the actual comic.
                    I've now read that and it was good for a laugh.

                    So the new atheists are promoting anti-feminist views which are labeled here as 'conservative'?
                    That is pretty funny - I suspect the new atheists are tired of watching government via victimology.
                    It has nothing to do with conservatism.
                    Actually YOU put Trump in the White House. He wouldn't have gotten 1% of the vote if it wasn't for the widespread spiritual and cultural devastation caused by progressive policies. There's no "this country" left with your immigration policies, your "allies" are worthless and even more suicidal than you are and democracy is a sick joke that I hope nobody ever thinks about repeating when the current order collapses. - Darth_Executor striking a conciliatory note in Civics 101

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Darth Executor View Post
                      You were right to suspect something is amiss, the whole thing is intended to be an apologia for modern feminism. This becomes clear if you read the piece after the actual comic.
                      No one said it couldn't have a subplot, but yeah if it hurts your ego a bit too much, I get it.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Meh Gerbil View Post
                        The Existential comics were hitting the men you enumerated.
                        I responded that such a target may be poorly considered.

                        That is on topic.

                        You obviously don't care to discuss that, which is fine.
                        I'll leave you be.

                        Oh so you did it read now... that's a good first step.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I found this quote by Stephen Hawking from his book The Grand Design:

                          “We wonder, we seek answers: What is the nature of reality? Where did all this come from? Did the universe need a creator? Traditionally, these are questions for philosophy, but philosophy is dead. Philosophers have not kept up with modern developments in science”.

                          Did not have the original source but found it in this rather interesting article: https://www.irishtimes.com/news/educ...tism-1.1656080

                          Surely a lot has been going on with "modern developments in science" if it can answer all these questions. Let’s look at some of the questions mentioned:

                          What is the nature of reality?
                          It’s hard to see how one can escape metaphysics in this one. One cannot rule out the possibility of a reality beyond the realm of human senses or the human mind. One can have an approach that is not open to it like that of logical positivism, but that does not prove anything but the limits of their own approach. Even claiming that ultimate reality is material is to make a metaphysical statement about ultimate reality, since it is a statement about ultimate reality. It is even a statement that one cannot prove.

                          Where did all this come from?
                          Yep, why does something exist instead of absolutely nothing. Never seen a scientist - or a philosopher for that matter - answer that question. If science is to examine reality, it must exist beforehand. I find it hard to see exactly how one could go back to the ultimate reason for anything to exist using that method. But I would like to have an explanation if anyone knows.
                          "Yes. President Trump is a huge embarrassment. And it’s an embarrassment to evangelical Christianity that there appear to be so many who will celebrate precisely the aspects that I see Biblically as most lamentable and embarrassing." Southern Baptist leader Albert Mohler Jr.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Jin-roh View Post
                            No one said it couldn't have a subplot, but yeah if it hurts your ego a bit too much, I get it.
                            catty
                            "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

                            There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Charles View Post
                              I found this quote by Stephen Hawking from his book The Grand Design:

                              “We wonder, we seek answers: What is the nature of reality? Where did all this come from? Did the universe need a creator? Traditionally, these are questions for philosophy, but philosophy is dead. Philosophers have not kept up with modern developments in science”.

                              Did not have the original source but found it in this rather interesting article: https://www.irishtimes.com/news/educ...tism-1.1656080

                              Surely a lot has been going on with "modern developments in science" if it can answer all these questions. Let’s look at some of the questions mentioned:

                              What is the nature of reality?
                              It’s hard to see how one can escape metaphysics in this one. One cannot rule out the possibility of a reality beyond the realm of human senses or the human mind. One can have an approach that is not open to it like that of logical positivism, but that does not prove anything but the limits of their own approach. Even claiming that ultimate reality is material is to make a metaphysical statement about ultimate reality, since it is a statement about ultimate reality. It is even a statement that one cannot prove.

                              Where did all this come from?
                              Yep, why does something exist instead of absolutely nothing. Never seen a scientist - or a philosopher for that matter - answer that question. If science is to examine reality, it must exist beforehand. I find it hard to see exactly how one could go back to the ultimate reason for anything to exist using that method. But I would like to have an explanation if anyone knows.
                              I attended a Richard Dawkins lecture where he maintained that we shouldn't ask the question of 'Why?' in science.
                              He said it was a loaded question.
                              I found it odd that a 'free thinker' would define questions that should not be asked.
                              Actually YOU put Trump in the White House. He wouldn't have gotten 1% of the vote if it wasn't for the widespread spiritual and cultural devastation caused by progressive policies. There's no "this country" left with your immigration policies, your "allies" are worthless and even more suicidal than you are and democracy is a sick joke that I hope nobody ever thinks about repeating when the current order collapses. - Darth_Executor striking a conciliatory note in Civics 101

                              Comment

                              Related Threads

                              Collapse

                              Topics Statistics Last Post
                              Started by shunyadragon, 03-01-2024, 09:40 AM
                              160 responses
                              507 views
                              0 likes
                              Last Post JimL
                              by JimL
                               
                              Started by seer, 02-15-2024, 11:24 AM
                              88 responses
                              354 views
                              0 likes
                              Last Post shunyadragon  
                              Started by Diogenes, 01-22-2024, 07:37 PM
                              21 responses
                              133 views
                              0 likes
                              Last Post shunyadragon  
                              Working...
                              X