Revelation 22:6 reads: "And he said to me, "These words are faithful and true"; and the Lord, the
God of the spirits of the prophets, sent His angel to show to His bond-servants the things which
must soon take place."

In this context what does "soon" mean?

As far as I can tell these events have not occurred yet, and it has been roughly 2000 years since this was written. That doesn't seem very soon. Thoughts?

Soon meant then what it means now. The events did happen soon. Within several years.

The book of Revelation is explicit at several points that the events are soon, that they are about to happen, and that this is why it had to be written.

Compare Daniel 8:26 with Revelation 22:10 to see what I mean.

Originally posted by Makarios

Revelation 22:6 reads: "And he said to me, "These words are faithful and true"; and the Lord, the
God of the spirits of the prophets, sent His angel to show to His bond-servants the things which
must soon take place."

In this context what does "soon" mean?

As far as I can tell these events have not occurred yet, and it has been roughly 2000 years since this was written. That doesn't seem very soon. Thoughts?

Probably John thought the events he described were going to occur "soon", and they probably didn't happen. Make of it what you will.

Wait, you're prepared to have Scripture explicitly teaching something that's not true?

Originally posted by Jack Bauer

Wait, you're prepared to have Scripture explicitly teaching something that's not true?

Maybe. I'm not sure yet. I certainly wouldn't cash in my faith if it did.

Originally posted by Dee Dee Warren

Soon meant then what it means now. The events did happen soon. Within several years.

There is still mourning, crying and pain (Rev. 21:4) so how has this already occurred?

Those who go for the orthodox preterist interpretation, as Xena nd Jack do, see the following events as still being in our future:

The physical return of Jesus
The resurrection of the just and unjust
The Final Judgement
The New Heavens and New Earth when there will be no more sorrow.

Everything else in prophecy was fulfilled in some way in AD70 when Jerusalem and the temple were destroyed by the Romans. I'll leave them to argue for the specifics of those prophecies as I'm not very knowledgable about those nut and bolt issues.

Orthodox Preterists stand in contrast with the heretical variety know variously as Full Preterists, Hyperpreterists, Pantelists, or (to use the term Xena came up with) (Neo)Hymenaeans which is a reference to the heretics Hymenaeus and Alexander whom Paul anathematized for teaching that the ressurection of the dead had allready occured.
Heretical Preterists teach that all of Scriptural prophecy was fulfilled in 70AD in some or another spiritual sense, including Rev. 21:4. For the heretical Preterists, there is no future resurrection nor return of Christ (at least, not that we are told of in Scripture).

Hope that helps.

Originally posted by Kelp the n00bseaweed

Those who go for the orthodox preterist interpretation, as Xena nd Jack do, see the following events as still being in our future:

The physical return of Jesus
The resurrection of the just and unjust
The Final Judgement
The New Heavens and New Earth when there will be no more sorrow.

Everything else in prophecy was fulfilled in some way in AD70 when Jerusalem and the temple were destroyed by the Romans. I'll leave them to argue for the specifics of those prophecies as I'm not very knowledgable about those nut and bolt issues.

Orthodox Preterists stand in contrast with the heretical variety know variously as Full Preterists, Hyperpreterists, Pantelists, or (to use the term Xena came up with) (Neo)Hymenaeans which is a reference to the heretics Hymenaeus and Alexander whom Paul anathematized for teaching that the ressurection of the dead had allready occured.
Heretical Preterists teach that all of Scriptural prophecy was fulfilled in 70AD in some or another spiritual sense, including Rev. 21:4. For the heretical Preterists, there is no future resurrection nor return of Christ (at least, not that we are told of in Scripture).

Hope that helps.

Thanks. I'm just wondering how Rev. 21:4 could have been fulfilled.

Originally posted by Makarios

Thanks. I'm just wondering how Rev. 21:4 could have been fulfilled.

Yeah, that would be a tough one. I have no idea.

Originally posted by Kelp the n00bseaweed

Those who go for the orthodox preterist interpretation, as Xena nd Jack do, see the following events as still being in our future:

I think when we start with - not questions about systematic eschatology - but about passages of Scripture, we are forced to give answers that are ucomfortable. The OP asks what "soon" means. Well, it means soon! Throughout the book there is that emphasis - the first audience needed to know this stuff urgently, because it was about to happen.

If we want to talk about systematic eschatology, and not basic exegesis anymore, then we're putting the horse before the cart. Those questions can only be addressed after all the "what does this text mean" questions havebeen addressed.

In the Gospel of John, Jesus said He would be gone a "little while" (John 14:19). You may think that He spoke of the time after the crucifixion and before the resurrection, but such was not the case. He was speaking of going to the Father, (John 16:16) and after the resurrection He made it clear He had not yet ascended to the Father (John 20:17). So the little while refers to His second coming.

The promises of God are spoken of in a timeless way. See how the prophecies of the OT are spoken of and how they are fulfilled (Isa 46:13, Isa 51:5, Rom 1:17, Rom 3:21-26).

Jesus comes in the church. The church fathers called this the continual coming of Christ in the church. I have a couple of interesting threads on the subject you might want to check.

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/sh...ad.php?t=53053

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/sh...ad.php?t=13156

Originally posted by Makarios

Thanks. I'm just wondering how Rev. 21:4. could have been fulfilled.

Proleptically, as in this statement by Paul:

2 Corinthians 5:17—(NRSV)

So if anyone is in Christ, there is a new creation: everything old has passed away; see, everything has become new!

Originally posted by Makarios

Revelation 22:6 reads: "And he said to me, "These words are faithful and true"; and the Lord, the
God of the spirits of the prophets, sent His angel to show to His bond-servants the things which
must soon take place."

In this context what does "soon" mean?

As far as I can tell these events have not occurred yet, and it has been roughly 2000 years since this was written. That doesn't seem very soon. Thoughts?

One day is as a thousand years to God.

Soon is relative to God not man as in all such statements.

The kingdom was at hand. Yes, The spiritual birth or the new mind that dwells in the begotten Children of God isn't placed in the context of time as we know it. Let the mind be in us that is in Christ. The first stage of this is spiritual rebirth. SO the kingdom is at hand in the church not the world. It is a light to the world. Soon is relative to God's meaning and to God soon could be to man a long time. It is soon to the spirit of God not the spirit of Man. Watch ye there for for you know not what hour our Lord comes. Who will he find laboring? To those who were Believers, who had heard the Gospel and believed, now was the day of salvation. Soon as in our salvation yes, But soon in context of prophetic fulfillment of events Naah! Nature had to run its course.

MDN

Originally posted by Jack Bauer

I think when we start with - not questions about systematic eschatology - but about passages of Scripture, we are forced to give answers that are ucomfortable. The OP asks what "soon" means. Well, it means soon! Throughout the book there is that emphasis - the first audience needed to know this stuff urgently, because it was about to happen.

If we want to talk about systematic eschatology, and not basic exegesis anymore, then we're putting the horse before the cart. Those questions can only be addressed after all the "what does this text mean" questions havebeen addressed.

Well excuuuuuuse me! I was just trying to help out with some basic information. I knew and stated that you guys might come round to flesh out your Scriptural case, which I agree should be the first priority.

If the word "soon" can mean anything (as your post suggests) then it means nothing at all. Everywhere else the word "soon" is used it means within a few years at most. According to the logic of your response "soon" could mean 5 minutes or 5 billion years. Why bother using the word at all?