Originally posted by Theoferrum

I'm still looking into the rust thing - however, if Baton Rouge is right and that artifact is Iron and not Wood then it should have rusted away by now.

Care to explain that one?

Why? If it were only recently exposed to the corroding influences of our atmosphere? Has all the iron ore rusted out of the ground?

Originally posted by Theoferrum

Actually, the Missing Link Poster Child is more of an understatement. Perhaps, since Roland copped out, you could explain to everyone how that poster does not indicate that at one time evolutionists thought their Uncle was a Monkey?

wattsr1 lives in the land of Oz down under. His available hours aren't the same as those in the U.S. or Europe.

Originally posted by rogue06

Since you made such a fuss about this one.

They are naturally forming and not man-made.

Similar pipe-like structures to the so-called Baigong pipes in the form of hematite "pipes" formed as a result of the precipitation of iron oxides within the sediments have been found in Jurassic sandstone like the Navajo in the Southwestern United States as well as in the Pliocene age Citronelle formations in Louisiana. Being more resistant to erosion an amazing variety of shapes including hollow pipes gets exposed as the surrounding sandstone erodes away.

Wikipedia goes into more detail: Baigong Pipes

No - the calcium embedded in the pipes are naturally occuring - which the picture below makes obvious, unless of course the perfect circle can be explained by a monkey's uncle :

"Because any metallurgical analysis reports the composition of a material analyzed, not in terms of the actual minerals comprising it, but only in terms of percentages of the oxides of the specific elements present, the calcium present in the "pipes" could have been in the form of calcite, a mineral that naturally forms concretions. In 2002, expeditions to study the Baigong Pipes were reportedly planned. Anonymous (2002a, 2002b) reported that a group of nine Chinese scientists were to visit and study them in June 2002. A group of researchers from the Beijing UFO Research Association were making preparations to visit and study these pipe-like features. Wikipedia"

Originally posted by Theoferrum

Yes and the picture shows it to be streamlined - angular - not rounded as the pictures you provide.

But, either way - explain how that 'iron' lasted, what, a couple hundred million years in that stone without, er, rusting...

Being from a streambed it is not at all surprising to find them rounded off.

You actually expect iron still embedded in stone to have rusted away? Just where do you think the iron ore we still excavate from the ground every day comes from if you expect it to have er, rusted?

Here is what an exray of the Geode looked like :

Spark Plug

"This what the rockhounds saw when they cut it in half. X-rays of the objects were taken and examined by Paul Willis, then editor of INFO Journal who noticed a startling similarity between it and a modern spark plug. An unnamed geologist in the original report of the find came up with an age estimate of 500,000 years based on the fossils contained in the matrix (note-this would not indicate what date the accretion was formed).

http://www.byerly.org/whatifo.htm

Originally posted by rogue06

Why? If it were only recently exposed to the corroding influences of our atmosphere? Has all the iron ore rusted out of the ground?

The opporative term is "if it were only recently exposed".

Originally posted by Theoferrum

No - the calcium embedded in the pipes are naturally occuring - which the picture below makes obvious, unless of course the perfect circle can be explained by a monkey's uncle :

"Because any metallurgical analysis reports the composition of a material analyzed, not in terms of the actual minerals comprising it, but only in terms of percentages of the oxides of the specific elements present, the calcium present in the "pipes" could have been in the form of calcite, a mineral that naturally forms concretions. In 2002, expeditions to study the Baigong Pipes were reportedly planned. Anonymous (2002a, 2002b) reported that a group of nine Chinese scientists were to visit and study them in June 2002. A group of researchers from the Beijing UFO Research Association were making preparations to visit and study these pipe-like features. Wikipedia"

How does naturally forming calcium within the supposed pipes disprove that the pipes aren't themselves naturally occurring hematite structures formed as a result of the precipitation of iron oxides within the sediments such as seen in Louisiana and in the southwest U.S.?

Here is some more Metal Mania for Baton Rouge and Company. Now, some people imply that these are proof of Alien Technology but the more logical conclusion is that it is proof of Antediluvial Civilization that perished in the Flood which, once again, in the process, destroys the man made dating methods.

It also addresses the Rust Factor in Antediluvial Metals.

SENSATIONAL FIND IN RUSSIA

By Hartwig Hausdorf Frank-Caro-Str. 94a, D - 84518, Garching-a.d.Alz, Germany

In the years 1991-1993, gold prospectors on the small river Narada, on the eastern side of the Ural mountains, have found unusual, mostly spiral-shaped objects. The size of these things ranges from a maximum of 3 cm (1.2 in.) down to an incredible 0.003 mm, about 1/10,000th of an inch! To date, these inexplicable artifacts have been found in their thousands at various sites near the rivers Narada, Kozhim, and Balbanyu, and also by two smaller streams named Vtvisty and Lapkhevozh, mostly at depths between 3 and 12 meters (10 and 40 ft.). The spiral-form objects are composed of various metals: the larger ones are of copper, while the small and very small ones are of the rare metals tungsten and molybdenum. Tungsten has a high atomic weight, and is also very dense, with a melting point of 3410 deg. C (6100 deg. F). It is used principally for the hardening of special steels, and in unalloyed form for the filaments of light bulbs. Molybdenum also has a high density, and a respectable melting point of 2650 deg. C 4740 deg. F). This metal too is used for hardening steels and giving them corrosion-resistant properties, these being used principally for highly-stressed weapon parts and vehicle
armor.

http://www.qtm.net/~geibdan/a1999/oct/ice2.htm

And here is another one.

Dr Gurlt's Cube

Another question without an answer is the cube found by Dr. Gurlt in 1885 adhered to a carbon block in a mine near Salzburg, Austria. A cube, exactly a parallelepiped, with slightly rounded borders and some unknown inscriptions which didn’t seem to be a nature’s work. The tests done increased the enigma: the cube, with a size of 67 mm x 67 mm x 47 mm and a weight of almost 8 kg, was made of a special steel, as it contained nickel and very little sulphur, and was dated in 500 million years, when vegetal life was inconsequential and amphibians not even existed. This cube had non identifiable inscriptions. Researches by the technicians of the time concluded that the cube was an object produced through very advanced techniques and that its alloy was not a nature’s work, but they left unanswered the question about what or who could have processed metals during that time. Dr. Gurlt donated the cube to the sciences museum of Salzburg City and in 1910 the object mysteriously disappeared, and along with it disappeared all the archives of the museum from 1880 to 1910.

http://www.cubanow.net/pages/loader....&t=2&item=4170

Another site reports that Dr. Gurlt said, "Other intelligent beings and civilizations existed on earth far beyond our recorded history" and note this was by a professional geologist in the days of Darwin and it perfectly describes Antediluvia.

Last Quote and Photo from :

http://chrisperridas.blogspot.com/20...rlts-cube.html

Originally posted by rogue06

How does naturally forming calcium within the supposed pipes disprove that the pipes aren't themselves naturally occurring hematite structures formed as a result of the precipitation of iron oxides within the sediments such as seen in Louisiana and in the southwest U.S.?

How does it prove they are, Sherlock?

Originally posted by rogue06

Being from a streambed it is not at all surprising to find them rounded off.

You actually expect iron still embedded in stone to have rusted away? Just where do you think the iron ore we still excavate from the ground every day comes from if you expect it to have er, rusted?

As already stated once, your opporative words were, "if if was recently exposed" which is the whole point, isn't it.

I do not recall the article mentioning - like so many of the artifacts found in coal - that they happened to cut that rock open and lo and behold, there it was.

Perhaps you would like to talk about those? Or the last two that I mentioned?

Here is another one where a block of rock was cut open exposing an anomalous artifact - at which point it started rusting...

Out-of-Place Metal Objects

Humans were not even around 65 million years ago, never mind people who could work metal. So then how does science explain semi-ovoid metallic tubes dug out of 65-million-year-old Cretaceous chalk in France? In 1885, a block of coal was broken open to find a metal cube obviously worked by intelligent hands. In 1912, employees at an electric plant broke apart a large chunk of coal out of which fell an iron pot! A nail was found embedded in a sandstone block from the Mesozoic Era. And there are many, many more such anomalies.

http://cybercityradio.com/html/ancientartifacts2.htm

Originally posted by Theoferrum

You are telling me that geologists did not arbitrarily assign dates to various strata without the aid of a known dating method? And then, dispite this, you are telling me that Darwin told them they should have?

Where was I telling you that Darwin told geologists that they should have arbitrarily assigned dates to various strata?


- FreezBee

Originally posted by Theoferrum

Here is the Book End to the Electrical Plug :

The Coso Geode

In 1961 a fossil encrusted geode was picked up in the Coso Mountains, six miles northeast of Olancha, California, near the top of a 4300' peak overlooking the dry bed of Owens Lake by some rockhounds. What was discovered after it had been cut in half is something that has caused much debate over the years, and continues to this day. In the middle of the geode was a metal core approximately .08" in diameter. Encircling this was what appeared to be a ceramic casing which was also surrounded by a hexagonal sleeve of wood, which had become petrified. This was encased by the outer layer of the geode which was made up of hardened clay, pebbles, and bits of fossil shell, and two nonmagnetic metallic objects resembling a nail and a washer.

http://www.byerly.org/whatifo.htm

Here I keep hoping you put forth an actual gem, something like the Antikytherea mechanism amidst all this drek and dross but you continue to disappoint with your parade of the same tired stuff. I mean, the Coso Artifact? What’s next Theo, the Calaveras or Olmo skulls? Homo Diluvii Testis??

First, the object is most definitely not in a geode. They were out hunting geodes but the object itself, as Wikipedia notes was "encased in a lump of hard clay or rock."

Second, the object here has been positively identified as a 1920's era Champion spark plug which became encased in a concretion composed of iron derived from the rusting spark plug. The formation of this iron oxide nodule was probably accelerated by the fact that corrosive "mineral dust" is blown off Lake Owen's dry lake bed and up onto the adjacent uplands where the artifact was discovered.

coso_3a_detail.jpg

The first source cited below notes that...

"For an excellent review of how ferrous and non-ferrous alloys decay over time, please see "The Elements of Archaeological Conservation" by J.M. Cronyn. This article includes numerous photographs, including X-rays, of contemporary objects that have completely decayed into oxide nodules. Like the Coso Artifact, these examples also feature empty cavities where the original materials once resided. Examples include X-rays of a nodule containing the perfectly preserved shape of a bolt, plating on a padlock (including its internal workings), and a belt buckle."

...for those actually interested.



Further Reading:

Coso Artifact

The “Coso Artifact”

Mortar and Pestle from Table Mountain

In 1877 Mr. J.H. Neale was superintendent of the Montezuma tunnel Company, and ran the Montezuma tunnel into the gravel underlying the lava of Table Mountain, Tuolumne County. At a distance of between 1400 and 1500 feet from the mouth of the tunnel, or of between 200 and 300 feet beyond the edge of the solid lava, Mr. Neale saw several spear-heads, of some dark rock and nearly one foot in length. On exploring further, he himself found a small mortar three or four inches in diameter and of irregular shape. This was discovered within a foot or two of the spear-heads. He then found a large well-formed pestle. Mr. Neale declares that it is utterly impossible that these relics can have reached the position in which they were found excepting at the time the gravel was deposited, and before the lava cap formed. There was not the slightest trace of any disturbance of the mass or of any natural fissure into it by which access could have been obtained either there or in the neighborhood.

http://paranormal.about.com/gi/o.htm...com/museum.htm

Originally posted by Theoferrum

How does it prove they are, Sherlock?

My slow-witted and easily confused friend it was you that claimed that they disproved a natural origin.

Originally posted by Theoferrum

No - the calcium embedded in the pipes are naturally occuring

I asked in what way is this so and like a third grader you respond "How does it prove they are, Sherlock"?

This is a fair warning to those sarcastically impaired the following is in jest:

Well, I know when I've been out-witted.