Judaism Today

[The_Chosen]

My question is first and foremost to any Jews here on TWeb. Anyone else with a good knowledge of modern Judaism in all its forms is also welcome to reply.
I recently attented a Shabbat service for a class I'm in and realized just how much I don't know about Judaism. I didn't have a clue what was going on (of course, the fact that I don't know Hebrew didn't help that.) Anyway, I was wondering if any of you guys could lay out the basics for me. What are the general beliefs amoung the different groups of Jews and how do the orthodox, reformed, and conservatives disagree? What are the basics of salvation/atonement? Who exactly is God? What are the feasts/holidays/observances and what do they stand for? These are the sorts of questions I have. Anyone with information on this would be greatly appreciated. I ask that if you aren't a Jew, you tell me how you learned the information that you present. Thanks for you time.

Danielle

[stillsmallvoice]

Hi Danielle!

As far as I know, I'm the only orthodox Jew here at TWeb. A very good place to look is http://www.jewfaq.org/toc.htm . This site has articles on everything, including all of the things you mentioned in your post. It's the best site I've come across for explaining Judaism to non-Jews. If you have any specific or personal questions, please feel free to ask! (Where are you studying?)

Good luck!

Be well!

ssv :hi:

[Timothy Leary]

What are the general beliefs amoung the different groups of Jews and how do the orthodox, reformed, and conservatives disagree? What are the basics of salvation/atonement? Who exactly is God? What are the feasts/holidays/observances and what do they stand for?

Great Questions!

For questions from the Orthodox Jewish perspective, in addition to the site given above by ssv, I would reccommend:

www.aish.com

www.askmoses.com

Orthodox Judaism strictly adheres to the Tanakh (Old Testament) and the Talmud in day2day life. The basic principles of Orthodox Judaism are outlined by the midevil sage Maimonides, which you can view at:

http://www.mesora.org/13principles.html

Reform Judaism is an extremely liberal group, and because of a large number of Atheistic Jews who attend reform congregations, the majority of Reform does not hold any of the commandments to be binding. Reform Judaism has the most large number of adherants. I guess the best place to start would be at:

http://www.uahc.org/index.html

Conservative Judaism was created in a reaction to Reform Judaism. They didn't agree with Orthodox Judaism fully, but believed the Reform movement had gone too far off the wall. They adhere to much of the Talmud and Tanakh, but don't observe all the commandments. I don't know of any Conservative sites, so I coudln't reccommend anything to you.

Karaite Judaism is similar to Orthodox Judaism in that it strictly requires observance to the Torah. We differ in that we do not hold the Talmud to be authoritive. Today we are the smallest group in Judaism, numbering somewhere between 50,000-100,000.

I would reccommend starting at:

www.karaite-korner.org

And of course, my site :)

I'll hit some your other questions later.

[The_Chosen]

stillsmallvoice,

This subject is rather complicated but to put it simply, I grew up in a Christian home going to Baptist church all my life and recently I have felt that perhaps Christianity isn't all that everyone has made it out to be. I began looking at my belief in a god period and realized that my issue wasn't really with God, it was with the whole New Testament aspect of salvation without anything but belief in Yeshua required. It seems very odd to me that for all those thousands of years God would have things done one way and then, thousands of years later say, ok, now the law is no more and salvation is only avaliable through the belief in my son Yeshua and his sacrifice for your sins. That doesn't make a great deal of sense to me. I have since begun to look at Judaism, the beliefs held by those people and the points made by Jews and coverted Jews about the New Testament and this "new" salvation that it proclaims and am beginning to think it really might all be a false teaching. So that is why I am looking at Judaism. I truly believe that the Jews are Gods chosen people and I really think that maybe Christians messed everything up with their false beliefs. Any other questions, feel free to ask.

Danielle

[The_Chosen]

stillsmallvoice,

One more thing, I looked at my reply and realized that I totally misread your question. My apologies and now for a simple response that truly is simple. I'm studying at UNC Chapel Hill. Sorry about the confusing response above.

Danielle

[Fideist345]

11-20-2003 @ 10:42 AM post located here (http://www.theologyweb.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=301076#post301076)
The_Chosen:

stillsmallvoice,

This subject is rather complicated but to put it simply, I grew up in a Christian home going to Baptist church all my life and recently I have felt that perhaps Christianity isn't all that everyone has made it out to be.

American or Southern Baptist?


I began looking at my belief in a god period and realized that my issue wasn't really with God, it was with the whole New Testament aspect of salvation without anything but belief in Yeshua required.


This is a tenet of some protestants. Catholics, Orthodox, most moderate and most liberal Christians reject or question this idea.


It seems very odd to me that for all those thousands of years God would have things done one way and then, thousands of years later say, ok, now the law is no more and salvation is only avaliable through the belief in my son Yeshua and his sacrifice for your sins. That doesn't make a great deal of sense to me.


Then you may want to take a look at less conservative forms of Christianity. Marcus Borg is a columnist with Beliefnet.com. You may want to take a look at his articles or take a look at his book descriptions at Amazon.


I have since begun to look at Judaism, the beliefs held by those people and the points made by Jews and coverted Jews about the New Testament and this "new" salvation that it proclaims and am beginning to think it really might all be a false teaching. So that is why I am looking at Judaism.

A very good idea. Judaism may be for you.

I truly believe that the Jews are Gods chosen people

Yes, but look at what Jewish people mean by that. Another columnist at

www.Beliefnet.com

is Rabbi David Wolpe. He has a very good article on that subject. First go to "religions" then find "columnists". If that fails, do a search on the name. You may also find his books helpful. Especially "The Healer of Shattered Hearts".


and I really think that maybe Christians messed everything up with their false beliefs.

Again, Christianity is not monoloithic. There are some very good articles concerning the differences at:

www.religioustolerance.org

Take a look at the tables on what liberal Christians tend to believe as compared to conservatives. You might be surprised.

And another site I've found helpful in understanding Judaism is:

www.shamash.org

Best of luck, Danielle, with your search!

[stillsmallvoice]

Hi all!

Danielle, your first response was not confusing, not in the least bit. If it came from your heart, then it is enlightening!

It seems very odd to me that for all those thousands of years God would have things done one way and then, thousands of years later say, ok, now the law is no more and salvation is only avaliable through the belief in my son Yeshua and his sacrifice for your sins.

This is a point we've been trying to make ever since Christianity jelled as a separate religion. There are enough verses in the Torah which state that it is an eternal Torah & that the covenant that God made with us at Mt. Sinai is, likewise, eternal. The ninth of Maimonedes (http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/biography/Maimonides.html) 13 Principles of Judaism (http://www.ou.org/torah/rambam.htm) states:

I believe with perfect faith that this Torah will not be changed, and that there will never be another given by God.

It is our contention, of course, that there are no references to Jesus, the trinity or the Incarnation in the Tanakh. We have our own understandings of each & every verse which Christians may claim is a reference to one of theses three.

That doesn't make a great deal of sense to me.

Nor does it to us.

Any other questions, feel free to ask.

Have you thought about actually converting to Judaism? (I have 2 converts in my family & there are several in our neighborhood http://www.jr.co.il/ma/pic/ma012.htm & in our synagogue.)

I moved to Israel in November 1986. That's when I became observant , i.e. orthodox. My dual decision to come to Israel & become orthodox was very sudden. I tell people, half-jokingly, that a bolt of (Divinely-tossed) lightning fell on my head. (My family is not even remotely close to orthodox, not involved in Jewish community at all & rather assimilated.)

I got my BA from GWU in the spring of 1985. I was getting ready to go back to GWU & start working on my MA in the fall of 1985. I quickly realized that if I did that, I'd go stark raving bonkers very quickly. I needed some time off. The Dean was very cool. He gave me a leave of absence for 1 year. I was admitted, but my actual registration was deferred to the fall of 1986.

I worked at my summer job (bartending) in Ocean City, Md. until the restaurant closed for the winter at the end of October. There is nothing more therapeutically head-clearing than being in a bustling seaside resort AFTER Labor Day, when things start winding down. I am convinced that that period helped clear my head & lay the sub-conscious groundwork for my bolt-out-of-the-blue decision. (See Song of Songs 5:2, "I was asleep but my heart was awake.")

For November & half of December, I went back to Pittsburgh & vegetated. Just before Xmas 1985, I went back to DC & crashed with friends till I found a flat (in a group apartment). I then found a job (waiting tables in Falls Church, Va) & figured that I'd work until it was time to go back to class in the fall of 1986.

Or so I thought. I went back to DC one day after Xmas. I still had friends on campus, my bank was there, etc. The corner of 21st St & Pennsylvania Ave. (now a parking lot, Grrrr....) then housed the Circle Theatre, which showed old movies. That day it was showing "Fiddler on the Roof". I saw it once when I was a little kid (parents dragged me). I had time to spare & nothing else to do, so I bought a ticket & went in.

Near the beginning of the film, Tevye the dairyman talks about "tradition." He said: "Because of our traditions, each one of us knows who he is and what God expects him to do." I reeled. That hit me for such a loop; I really went flying. It was like getting hit in the head with a puck. I had never thought about it that way before. I had no clue who I was and that God a) knew I existed, b) cared, and c) actually wanted me to DO something was something utterly, utterly new to me. I was in shock. I watched the rest of the film in a semi-trance & then at the end, after the pogrom, when all the Jews have to leave the village, the old matchmaker comes up to Tevye's wife & tells her that she is going to (the Land of) Israel. WHACK! That was puck-to-the-head #2. I went reeling again. I left the theater in quite a state. I took the Metro back home & decided then and there that I had to become orthodox (keep kosher, study scripture, keep Shabbat, pray regularly, the works, etc., etc,) and come to Israel.

My parents (whom I didn't tell until I had occasion to go back to Pittsburgh in April 1986 for Passover) were absolutely shocked. By then, I had already registered for a special Hebrew-language school here in Israel (where I met my Cape Town-born wife) & sent in a non-refundable deposit. I worked in Falls Church until mid-September. I arrived here in early November.

I have never regretted my decision(s) and never looked back. I believe that God Himself decided that if He had to wait on me to come to Him, He'd probably still be waiting, so He decided to come to me, via the movie "Fiddler on the Roof." (He talked to Moses from a thorn bush, didn't He?) He called to me & I have been answering His call ever since, His Name be praised!

Be well & be in touch!

ssv :hi:

[The_Chosen]

Fideist345
[QUOTE]Fideist345:

"American or Southern Baptist?"

Indy Baptist actually.

As to all the sites you referenced for me, thanks, I'll give them a look and hopefully they will be enlightening.

Danielle

[The_Chosen]

StillSmallVoice,

Thanks for the story about your conversion. That was very helpful to hear about someone else who had converted. Honestly, it is something I'm looking at right now. I'm talking to our campus rabbi and trying to learn as much as I can about Judaism because I really think it may be the right choice for me. As I said before, I don't have any problem believing in God, I just take issue with the concepts of Christianity and the general belief in salvation through belief in the sacrifice of Jesus. So I'm seriously looking into Judaism with the belief that I may indeed convert. If you wouldn't mind, I would like to ask you a few questions as well especially about Kosher laws and the like. Once again, thank you for your help and support.

Danielle

[Fideist345]

Today @ 02:36 PM post located here (http://www.theologyweb.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=312207#post312207)
The_Chosen:

Fideist345
[QUOTE]Fideist345:

"American or Southern Baptist?"

Indy Baptist actually.

As to all the sites you referenced for me, thanks, I'll give them a look and hopefully they will be enlightening.

Danielle

Sure! Again, best of luck. :thumb: It can be a long drawn out affair.

[stillsmallvoice]

Hi all!

Danielle, thank you for your post!

I apologize if I did not make myself clear enough. I was born Jewish but did not actively embrace my faith until after I had my movie theater epiphany.

I'm talking to our campus rabbi and trying to learn as much as I can about Judaism because I really think it may be the right choice for me...So I'm seriously looking into Judaism with the belief that I may indeed convert.

Is the rabbi at UNC-Chapel Hill orthodox? I see that there is a modern orthodox synagogues in Raleigh & a chasidic orthodox synagogue in Chapel Hill.

http://www.geocities.com/orthodox_conversion_to_judaism/ is a very good site on orthodox conversion; the article http://www.geocities.com/orthodox_conversion_to_judaism/Article_YHerskowitz.html is very good. Becoming a Jew (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0824603508/ref=ase_zenafeldmanA/102-2376016-7296912?v=glance&s=books) by Rabbi Maurice Lamm is an excellent source & presents conversion from a modern orthodox perspective. (Anything that Rabbi Maurice Lamm & his brother, Rabbi Norman Lamm, write is a very good presentation of things from a modern orthodox perspective. Their books The Jewish Way in Love and Marriage, A Hedge of Roses and The Jewish Way in Death and Mourning are all very good. If a Lamm has written it, it's good!)

Generally, someone who is thinking about converting should approach a LOR (Local Orthodox Rabbi & discuss his/her (the prospective convert's) concerns. It is the LOR's job to talk with the prospective convert, size up their seriousness & inform him/her of what being a Jew means (warts & all). The LOR will attempt to dissuade the would-be convert as part of his duty to ascertain her motives & see how serious he/she is (We learn this from Naomi's threefold attempt to dissuade Ruth from following her, see Ruth 1:8, 1:11-12 and 1:15). Once the LOR is satisfied as to the genuineness & seriousness of the would-be convert's motives, he will outline a course of intensive study (copying Naomi, who, once she understood that Ruth was totally serious, stopped trying to talk her out of it; see Ruth 1:18). This will include not just reading, but visiting an orthodox Jewish family, spending Shabbat (i.e. the Sabbath) and holydays with them, etc. After the LOR is satisfied that the prospective convert has studied enough, he will arrange for him/her to appear before a duly constituted rabbinical court (whether permanent or ad hoc), known as a beit din. When the three members of the beit din are satisfied that the would-be convert is both knowledgeable & sincere, they will sanction his/her conversion. A man will thereupon have to be circumcised; if he is already circumcised a drop of blood will have to be drawn from the glans of his penis (by someone specially trained!). The man will then have to immerse in a special ritual bath, known as a mikveh, in the presence of the beit din. A woman will have to immerse in the mikveh, in the presence of a duly authorized woman attendant. That's it. The person (who will be given a Hebrew name, either in addition to or in place of the person's previous name) is now Jewish & is usually welcomed with Boaz's blessing to Ruth (2:12):

"The Lord recompense your work, and be your reward complete from the Lord, the God of Israel, under whose wings you are come to take refuge."

If you wouldn't mind, I would like to ask you a few questions as well especially about Kosher laws and the like.

Ask away! It would be my pleasure to answer any questions that you might have as best I can. http://www.jewfaq.org/kashrut.htm is good introductory read on the subject.

Be well & be in touch!

ssv :hi:

[The_Chosen]

Today @ 06:23 AM post located here (http://www.theologyweb.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=314951#post314951)
stillsmallvoice:

I apologize if I did not make myself clear enough. I was born Jewish but did not actively embrace my faith until after I had my movie theater epiphany.



That may have been a misreading on my part anyway. I just had my wisdom teeth removed and have been a bit groggy from the pain killers anyway. Thanks for clearing things up for me.

Today @ 06:23 AM post located here (http://www.theologyweb.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=314951#post314951)
stillsmallvoice:


Is the rabbi at UNC-Chapel Hill orthodox? I see that there is a modern orthodox synagogues in Raleigh & a chasidic orthodox synagogue in Chapel Hill.



In all honesty, I'm not sure if she is orthodox or not. I'm waiting on her to reply to my last email about just such a question.

Also, thanks for all the websites and info you sent my way. It was greatly appreciated and I am looking into it as I am able. It's interesting since I had already been looking at a few of those sites you sent me. Right now, I have just one question about Kosher, is it hard to keep? Once again, thanks for all your help.

[stillsmallvoice]

Hi Danielle!

You posted:

In all honesty, I'm not sure if she is orthodox or not.

If she is a she, she is not orthodox.

Also, thanks for all the websites and info you sent my way.

You're welcome!

It's interesting since I had already been looking at a few of those sites you sent me.

A-HA! Small minds think alike! :teeth:

Right now, I have just one question about Kosher, is it hard to keep?

Absolutely not! Once you've got two sets of dishes (plus dishes for Passover) & get used to it, it becomes almost like a reflex. We have two sinks in our kitchen, one for meat & one for milk. You learn to read labels at the supermarket, looking for one or other of the recognized kashrut (the noun; kosher is the adjective) symbols (http://www.kashrut.com/agencies/); after a while, you'll get to know brands & labels. You'll learn to eat only at kosher restaurants, i.e. those under the kashrut supervision of a reliable orthodox authority (whether local or national). You'll learn to reserve a kosher meal when you fly. It's really not difficult at all, especially when you realize the twofold spiritual payoff: adhering to God's words & learning to control your appetites (and not have them control you).

Always feel entirely free to ask me anything you would like, either here or by PM!

Be well & be in touch!

ssv :hi:

[The_Chosen]

Hi ssv,

I would love to actually pm you sometime and ask a few questions this way instead of posting them a few at a time so as not to overwhelm you. This is something I will do some other time however seeing as how I'm at work right now and, should I actually be required to do something, I would have to disappear and might not reappear. Anyway, it's good to know that a woman cannot be a rabbi in orthodox Judaism. I didn't know that. So out of curiosity, since I've had trouble finding this, could she be conservative or would she have to be reformed? Also, I still am having a few problems understanding the differences between the different groups and therefore am not sure why you believe orthodox to be the best (right) one. If you wouldn't mind clearing that up, I would really appreciate it.

Thanks!
Danielle

[stillsmallvoice]

Hi Danielle!

Thank you for your post!

I would love to actually pm you sometime and ask a few questions this way instead of posting them a few at a time so as not to overwhelm you. This is something I will do some other time however seeing as how I'm at work right now and, should I actually be required to do something, I would have to disappear and might not reappear.

PM me whenever it is convenient for you!

So out of curiosity, since I've had trouble finding this, could she be conservative or would she have to be reformed?

She could be either.

Also, I still am having a few problems understanding the differences between the different groups and therefore am not sure why you believe orthodox to be the best (right) one. If you wouldn't mind clearing that up, I would really appreciate it.

First, I cite from http://www.jewfaq.org/movement.htm:

The Orthodox movements are all very similar in belief, and the differences are
difficult for anyone who is not Orthodox to understand. They all believe that G-d gave
Moses the whole Torah at Mount Sinai. The "whole Torah" includes both the Written
Torah (the first five books of the Bible) and the Oral Torah, an oral tradition
interpreting and explaining the Written Torah. They believe that the Torah is true, that
it has come down to us intact and unchanged. They believe that the Torah contains
613 mitzvot binding upon Jews but not upon non-Jews. This web site is written
primarily from the modern Orthodox point of view. The 1990 National Jewish
Population Survey (NJPS) performed by the Council of Jewish Federations found that
7% of the Jews in America identify themselves as Orthodox.

Reform Judaism does not believe that the Torah was written by G-d. The movement
accepts the critical theory of Biblical authorship: that the Bible was written by
separate sources and redacted together. Reform Jews do not believe in observance of
commandments as such, but they retain much of the values and ethics of Judaism,
along with some of the practices and the culture. The original, basic tenets of
American Reform Judaism were set down in the Pittsburgh Platform. Many
non-observant, nominal, and/or agnostic Jews identify themselves as Reform simply
because Reform is the most liberal movement, but that is not really a fair reflection on
the movement as a whole. The NJPS found that 42% of the Jews in America identify
themselves as Reform. There are approximately 900 Reform synagogues in the
United States and Canada. For more information about Reform Judaism, see The
Union of American Hebrew Congregations.

Conservative Judaism grew out of the tension between Orthodoxy and Reform. It
was formally organized as the United Synagogue of Conservative Judaism in by Dr.
Solomon Schechter in 1913, although its roots in the Jewish Theological Seminary of
America stretch back into the 1880s. Conservative Judaism maintains that the truths
found in Jewish scriptures and other Jewish writings come from G-d, but were
transmitted by humans and contain a human compontent. Conservative Judaism
generally accepts the binding nature of halakhah, but believes that the Law should
change and adapt, absorbing aspects of the predominant culture while remaining true
to Judaism's values. In my experience, there is a great deal of variation among
Conservative synagogues. Some are indistinguishable from Reform, except that they
use more Hebrew; others are practically Orthodox, except that men and women sit
together. Most are very traditional in substance, if not always in form. This flexibility
is deply rooted in Conservative Judaism, and can be found within their own Statement
of Principles, Emet ve-Emunah. The NJPS found that 38% of the Jews in America
identify themselves as Conservative. There are approximately 750 Conservative
synagogues in the world today.

Reconstructionist Judaism is theoretically an outgrowth of Conservative, but it doesn't
fit neatly into the traditional/liberal, observant/non-observant continuum that most
people use to classify movements of Judaism. Reconstructionists believe that Judaism
is an "evolving religious civilization." They do not believe in a personified deity that is
active in history, and they do not believe that G-d chose the Jewish people. From this,
you might assume that Reconstructionism is to the left of Reform; yet
Reconstructionism lays a much greater stress on Jewish observance than Reform
Judaism. Reconstructionists observe the halakhah if they choose to, not because it is a
binding Law from G-d, but because it is a valuable cultural remnant.
Reconstructionism is a very small movement but seems to get a disproportionate
amount of attention, probably because there are a disproportionate number of
Reconstructionists serving as rabbis to Jewish college student organizations and
Jewish Community Centers. Everyone I know seems to have had a Reconstructionist
rabbi at college or in a community center, yet according to the NJPS, only 1% of the
Jews in America identify themselves as Reconstructionist. There are less than 100
Reconstructionist synagogues world-wide. See the Jewish Reconstructionist
Federation home page.

The author of the http://www/jewfaq.org/toc.htm site that I like to cite so much writes (http://www.jewfaq.org/#Welcome):

The information in this site is written predominantly from the Orthodox viewpoint, because I believe that is the starting point for any inquiry into Judaism. As recently as 200 years ago, this was the only Judaism, and it still is the only Judaism in many parts of the world.

Traditional, normative Judaism (the Karaites aside, see http://www.jewfaq.org/movement.htm#Karaites) is orthodox. As you may read above, the Reform, Conservative & Reconstructionist movements are newfangled movements that developed in Europe, in reaction to the Enlightenment. They have junked so many core Jewish beliefs and, in effect, make it up as they go along, influenced by whatever happens to be trendy at the moment & taking care to be "politically correct". This is Judaism??!! I grew up, as I like to say, de jure Conservative but de facto nothing. I looked at what the Conservative movement offered & was thoroughly underwhelmed & unimpressed. Orthodox Judaism is all-encompassing and supplies a deep emotional commitment & spiritual food for the soul. Orthodox Judaism believes that the Torah comes from God; the Reform movement does not. The Conservative movement tries to straddle a middle ground that does not exist. If one does not believe that the Torah is from God, then what's the point? Judaism is not, and never has been, an everyone-for-him/herself religion. Orthodoxy (which is a broader spectrum than most non-Orthodox realize) recognizes that there is a certain set of core beliefs that are immutable & which serve to bind all Jews everywhere, much as they have for thousands of years. Take Shabbat (i.e. the Sabbath, see (http://www.jewfaq.org/shabbat.htm), most of the observance of which the Reform movement has junked altogether (I guess they ignore Isaiah 56:1-2 and 56:6-7) & which the Conservative movement has made "optional." An early Zionist writer wrote, about this binding set of core beliefs & norms which I've just mentioned, "More than the Jews have kept Shabbat, Shabbat has kept the Jews."

(The article I referred to in a previous post on why an orthodox conversion puts it rather well.) This http://www.ou.org/torah/belief.html is a good site too.

Be well!

ssv :hi: