Magdalenbrother
December 22nd 2004, 05:23 AM
Jesus loved harlots and tax collectors?
I don't buy it. In this post I will concentrate on the tax collectors.
If Jesus had loved tax collectors:
-he would have undermined his own credibility among the people whom he had targeted: the poor, disenfranchised masses of rural Galilea and Judea;
-he would have lent legitimacy to the Roman and Herodian fiscal administration, which were oppressing the Jewish people.
Jesus was not a man to associate with rich people. They were not on the same wavelengths. Remember how he treated Herod Antipas on the day of his trial. Not a word fell from his lips. Jesus, like James, despised and condemned the rich. Tax collectors, no matter what modern preachers may tell us to the contrary, were not ostracized people leading forlorn lives of utter loneliness. With money, you can buy everything, including respect and friendship. There was therefore no need at all for Jesus to pity these self-satisfied thugs.
Besides, he mentioned tax collectors in contexts that make it clear that he espoused the negative views most Jews had of them: "If your brother doesn't listen to you, treat him as you would a publican". If Jesus had appreciated the tax collectors, he wouldn't have said that.
"The harlots and tax collectors will enter heaven before you": this statement can be interpreted in two ways. To make this clear, let me change the Biblical saying thus:
"Saddam Hussein and Joseph Stalin will precede you in the Kingdom of Heaven."
Two possibilities:
You, the speaker, consider these people as unjustly villified by your interlocutor, whom you warn against rashness in judgment.
You, the speaker, consider Stalin and Hussein as immoral, despicable monsters. By telling your interlocutor that these devils will enter heaven before you, you are abusing them grievously.
I think that the second interpretation is the correct one, given the level of hostility between Jesus and the Pharisees.
How did the legend that Jesus liked the harlots and tax collectors arise?
-Because Jesus was in reality a tax protester, the editors of the Gospels were at pains to conceal this fact by claiming that he liked to eat with tax collectors. Such a story would reassure the Roman authorities.
-the Gospel writers needed to find good reasons to explain why the Jewish mases turned away from Jesus. They invented the story that he liked the very people whom ordinary Jews considered particularly evil: Samaritans, Gentiles, tax collectors and harlots.
-Other possibility: the whole idea began as a false accusation, a calumny, forged by Jesus' adversaries. Later on, the context in which the rumor had started was forgotten, and the people who wrote the Gospels came to believe that their revered master had indeed associated with such people with gusto.
Jesus said that the ill are in need of a physician, not the healthy?
Physician don't seek out their patients. Patients go and ask for their cures. People who were willing to become tax collectors were in all probability hardened materialists who didn't care at all about moral issues. It is highly improbable that they would have appreciated the teachings of Jesus, let alone invited him to dinner.
I consider the story of Zacchaeus fake. I consider the story of Levi true. Jesus wanted tax collectors, not to give some money back to the people, but to stop collecting taxes altogether. By calling Levi ex abrupto Jesus disrupted the fiscal administration.
That was his aim. :smile:
I don't buy it. In this post I will concentrate on the tax collectors.
If Jesus had loved tax collectors:
-he would have undermined his own credibility among the people whom he had targeted: the poor, disenfranchised masses of rural Galilea and Judea;
-he would have lent legitimacy to the Roman and Herodian fiscal administration, which were oppressing the Jewish people.
Jesus was not a man to associate with rich people. They were not on the same wavelengths. Remember how he treated Herod Antipas on the day of his trial. Not a word fell from his lips. Jesus, like James, despised and condemned the rich. Tax collectors, no matter what modern preachers may tell us to the contrary, were not ostracized people leading forlorn lives of utter loneliness. With money, you can buy everything, including respect and friendship. There was therefore no need at all for Jesus to pity these self-satisfied thugs.
Besides, he mentioned tax collectors in contexts that make it clear that he espoused the negative views most Jews had of them: "If your brother doesn't listen to you, treat him as you would a publican". If Jesus had appreciated the tax collectors, he wouldn't have said that.
"The harlots and tax collectors will enter heaven before you": this statement can be interpreted in two ways. To make this clear, let me change the Biblical saying thus:
"Saddam Hussein and Joseph Stalin will precede you in the Kingdom of Heaven."
Two possibilities:
You, the speaker, consider these people as unjustly villified by your interlocutor, whom you warn against rashness in judgment.
You, the speaker, consider Stalin and Hussein as immoral, despicable monsters. By telling your interlocutor that these devils will enter heaven before you, you are abusing them grievously.
I think that the second interpretation is the correct one, given the level of hostility between Jesus and the Pharisees.
How did the legend that Jesus liked the harlots and tax collectors arise?
-Because Jesus was in reality a tax protester, the editors of the Gospels were at pains to conceal this fact by claiming that he liked to eat with tax collectors. Such a story would reassure the Roman authorities.
-the Gospel writers needed to find good reasons to explain why the Jewish mases turned away from Jesus. They invented the story that he liked the very people whom ordinary Jews considered particularly evil: Samaritans, Gentiles, tax collectors and harlots.
-Other possibility: the whole idea began as a false accusation, a calumny, forged by Jesus' adversaries. Later on, the context in which the rumor had started was forgotten, and the people who wrote the Gospels came to believe that their revered master had indeed associated with such people with gusto.
Jesus said that the ill are in need of a physician, not the healthy?
Physician don't seek out their patients. Patients go and ask for their cures. People who were willing to become tax collectors were in all probability hardened materialists who didn't care at all about moral issues. It is highly improbable that they would have appreciated the teachings of Jesus, let alone invited him to dinner.
I consider the story of Zacchaeus fake. I consider the story of Levi true. Jesus wanted tax collectors, not to give some money back to the people, but to stop collecting taxes altogether. By calling Levi ex abrupto Jesus disrupted the fiscal administration.
That was his aim. :smile: